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Yamunsa

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Posts posted by Yamunsa

    FS - Gigabyte Z87X-OC

    in Sold

    Posted

    I wish I had checked out all the PCI E slots prior to greasing her up, then I would have been able to RMA it. :(

     

    take the hs assembly off and a couple of rounds in the dishwasher will fix that ;)

    R5: UGP/GTPP fix for exotic categories

    in HWBOT Rev.5

    Posted

    I'm also surprised at the value some people hold in points.

     

    if you were addressing my post i think you misunderstand what i was saying. a points system was put in place to achieve a competition. we know that points do mean something to some people. those that wished to be judged by others use it as a marker in their community standing. all this is marketing 101.

     

    by minimising the incentive for these people competition will flounder. i simply don't think that squashing something before it has a chance to grow is the right thing. it's a pretty simple idea.

     

    what is in place isn’t perfect by a longshot. is this the right way to move forward... i don't think so.

    R5: UGP/GTPP fix for exotic categories

    in HWBOT Rev.5

    Posted

    @Yamunsa

     

    Enough members of the community asked for this that HWB considered it worthwhile. Blame everyone who asked for it. That includes me.

     

    i'm not attributing blame. i didn't think i had. if i gave that impression from the line quoted by massman i was simply addressing pieters earlier comment, later underlined by himself, that as a paid advocate of the hobby we love brushing off another member with some snide comment about rainbows & unicorns was plain bs. he asked for a button to be pressed and i did.

     

    Why should people be given a load of points just for running a bench at stock MHz, with almost no competition? Who cares how long it takes to set up or tweak. I spent 6 hours yesterday trying to enable SLI. I saw so many BSODs, I thought I needed to have my eyes checked. Have I made a thread asking for more points as a reward for all my effort?

     

    i agree with you. stock runs are bs. my hand is firmly in the air to pull all those subs made through the years @ stock. lets reflect on 8800gtx, sandy and 06 subs for a start. and btw i feel for your sli/bsod. been there and know the feeling. got a new one last week with pwm adjustment crashing 3d.

     

    please don't think i believe the current situation is any good. i also don't think this change will be good for oc in the future. i also don't know of a perfect middle road to lay out. i did/do understand that irrespective of any comments made, in all likelihood this change will go ahead.

     

    So....what would you suggest? Flip the points around? 2-pointers are now worth 50? SOMETHING has to be at the bottom. The least-used hardware seems like a sensible choice to me.

     

    i've made a suggestion above based specifically on oc. i am 100% on the side of rubbishing lazy subs made @ stock especially if they earn globals.

     

    i hope that down the track that benching out of the norm would be rewarded. watching a number of rulings made previously with the reluctance to ever visit them again i had hoped to post my opinion before it makes the archives.

    R5: UGP/GTPP fix for exotic categories

    in HWBOT Rev.5

    Posted · Edited by Yamunsa

    apologies in advance as this is more of an airing my opinion than having any effect on this change... i'm working on the understanding that it's implementation is not under debate.

     

    i see this change as somewhat of a disappointment for a number of reasons. sure, seeing a few guys, (very few), run benchmarks on work servers at stock and creaming 60 globals for 10 mins of mouse click in their lunch hour was pretty appalling. i got nothing to stick up for this sort of benching... well it's not really benching is it.

     

    however, i recently noticed the lack of competition in the big core count categories to decided if i'm going to kiss it I might as well bunny it and bought a 4p rig to have a go.

     

    exotic... no not really. es opteron (unlocked chips) are cheap & plentiful on ebay. expensive board and a real pain fiddling with server 8 to get things humming true. side note - win7 ult recognises 256 cores but only 2 chips.. painful to redo a pc05 os from scratch i can tell you, especially if you have to switch half of server back on to get the bench to run and cull the other hale of the services to make a start on efficiency.

     

    having already gone through the unpleasant but 'popular' decision to permit ram drives in pcv and software cacheing raid in pc05 it's of no surprise that having chosen an unpopular benchmark to focus on as well as choosing uncommon gear to bench with i was bound to catch a kick in the nuts a few times.

     

    but, by limiting points attributed to uncommon setups minimises the desire for anyone to bother in the future. doesn't that sort of defeat the core purpose of hwbot? arn't most of us here reading this thread doing uncommon stuff like using Ln, stripping OSs, pushing the boundaries of gear to their limits?

     

    by penalising folks for taking an alternative route just seems counter productive. if the bot is going to play the popular game are we to expect users of Ln to start losing points? are we going to have a new category on watercooling setups and award randoms on who has the gayist flashing lights? are the big guns using 4 titans going to get pinged because their setup is better than mine? unlikely.. well not today anyway.

     

    taking on the quotes i'd like to reply to a few

     

    Great improvement!

     

    @ Rasparthe: The HWBot points have to represent the effort or skill it takes to achieve a score. 60 points for a result which was achieved on stock clocks is too much.

     

    as you may know retail opteron comes locked witrh turbo only. stock is something that has to be lived with to some degree. true, if you have a couple of specific supermicro boards you can flash the bios to a modded version but that only gives you a 12.5% boosts and takes no skill by the owner.. dl>flash>done. or 2 get a tyan board and if you know someone working near a opteron based supercomputer you might be lucky to get hold of an unlocked bios... breaking every eula / nda in the book. wprime is a great example of running lazy and catching boints for bunny all effort. Is it cooler and more acceptable to have a 1 click oc? hello sandybridge, remember annoying the bunnyextraction out of many?

     

    same chips challanging eachother on spi or pc05 would not be the case.

     

    Sadly, points are mostly rewarded by the number of "noobs" you beat, rather than the actual skill required to beat your score. Not only that, inactive rankings get devalued simply because there are few recent subs, not because the submission skill level has decreased.

     

    very true. scored good points the other week making subs on air using a q66, e66 & e8400. all 3 top 10 pc05 hw. all from good storage and knowing your os.

     

    Fine. We'll just implement that "rainbows and unicorns for all" algorithm we've secretly held back from you guys for the past five years.

     

    this comment is beneath you and only fuels the argument of poor consultation with the community.

     

    +1

     

    Grab an 960T, unlock it, make scores, have fun. Same goes probably to this i3 setup. These are really affordable possibilities in entering OC and getting actually some points.

     

    Of course getting 60 globals in superpi is a much harder job but we really take out diversity of the competition. Who will will fire up 4 Opterons for 10 points?

     

    I just want to say dont make the bot too strict, too exact. Let mutliple ways to accomplish things.

     

    I guess we cant change this now anyway as the patch seems to be about to be applied. So this was just my 2cents....

     

    a valid 2 cents and I agree. limit the desire of benching different and people wont. Of course duel core ivy @ stock running cine or xtu won't get cut from the fold but for many it's still somewhat of a joke. i made a sub on my htpc and had to wash my hands soon after lol.

     

    You know, there is a category of people who bench ridicilous setups just to get 2 hardware points for a gold cup. People who run 4x Opteron setups usually fall in such category anyway, so the bot will not lose much in terms of participants' numbers.

     

    the same can be said for those kids who save all their pocket money and instead of a first car they go buy 4 titans to be king of the epeeners. sure, who gives a rats about them too.

     

    Well, I can think of another solution, but it probably wouldn't be feasible... Instead of only awarding points based on number of participants, the algorithm could also account for the quality of participants you beat. For example, if you beat 9 other participants, that would be worth 10 points. If 2 of those participants were ranked highly within their league, you get additional bonuses because you beat other skilled Overclockers. Probably too complicated to implement, however it would address both the amount and quality of competition.

     

    Ultimately though, I am the opposite of rasparthe on this issue. I don't believe awarding the same points for beating 2000 people or for running hardware no one else bothers to run is any good, especially when it rewards stock clock submissions that rank people higher than others legitimately trying to overclock.

     

    ok, 2 things to reply to:

     

    1 the easiest way has been discussed previously on numerous occasions. reward folks on the percentage of oc achieved. much like a cpuz val apply the principle to other benches. one of my proudest moments was getting my old e66 past 100%oc. anyways, it's a nice idea that's never going to happen.

     

    2 many of the "stock clock submissions that rank people higher than others legitimately trying to overclock" are in the mix because of the way core categories are currently structured. there is no option to have a mixed cpu setup and little energy behind hwbot to change things. eg: i have 2 x 6380 and 4 x 6220. when i wanted to make a 48 sub using 2 of each i couldn't. i opened a thread to ask what to do and was told to enter the sub under the highest chip. so, my 48 core sub had to be a 64 core entrant.. now with a very easy 60 points, i mean who the bunny has a 64 core setup at hand to challenge i thought blow it and subbed to everything i could. woop woop free boints everywhere but all junk on top of lies. at the time I thought, why did I bother getting 2 x 16 cores when I could of got 1 and a few $30 quads and still toe the line.

     

    fix the multi cpu option, ask multi core subs to be corrected and watch the lower core count categories to be competitive and many of the high core count subs dissabear… oh, and i know you'll see less piss taking.

     

    The real annoying part of ALL the complaints and drama about the points is that this patch has not even been applied in production! None of the effects of this patch can be seen on the production. None.

     

    All we did was give a heads-up. It would be nice if, for a change, people would read the posts before starting all the drama.

     

    i think the complaints are coming from the minimal consultation, minimal effort to find an alternative route and another example of popularist politics and single-mindedness rearing it's head on the bot.

     

    pc05 caught a beating with all the bs from a select few last year and before the rules were set in stone the benchmark was ruined for many. warehouse benching is about to ruin things for the even fewer that have chosen to give enterprise gear a go. when this change goes ahead it'll be the last time you see pics like this for a lousy 10 points.

     

    P1370178_zps3c40989c.jpg

    knopflerbruce - 2x Xeon E7 8870 @ 2400MHz - 12.91 points CineBench R11.5

    in Result Discussions

    Posted

    With the ability to input multiple cpu models in a given submission.

    ie: one X5687 (four cores) and one E5645 (six cores)

     

    But the issue would still be; Under what cpu category would it ranked?

    The x5687 or the e5645?

     

    +1 for mixed option. can't imagine it would be an issue to add a drop down if the initial cpu chosen is enterprise level.

     

    as to subbing catagory i understand that currently the larger of the 2 cpus used in a sub would need to be the lead unit. with a mixed cpu option i imagine it would make no difference unless the participant is chasing HW points or cups... saying that mixed subs could just catch globals and there would be no issues.

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