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Posts posted by IanCutress
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ROG CPU-Z, using a Gigabyte board.
Vote now on bug, speed hack or photoshop...
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Wouldn't it be your task, as reviewer, to point out to this 'normal enthusiast user' that it's not a problem to run at a certain memory frequency as long as they change this one subtiming? Isn't it the task of a reviewer to make sure the reader is informed about this?
If I set the strap and it works, it works. If I have to go fishing for several hours to find if the next strap up works, where does it end? Do I up another strap, then see if that works too if I loosen a bit here, a bit there? Before you know it, you end up with 70hours of 'work' time gone and you don't get a penny extra if you work on a freelance basis. Prevail as an enthusiast vs. work to feed yourself is always a tough battle.
I agree that boards should work out-of-the box, with 'work' defined both in terms of overclocking capability ("Can it reach this frequency?") as well as performance ("Is it performing well?"). It's easy to reach a high frequency if you cripple the subtimings by default, but does that make the board an outstanding memory overclocker for the normal enthusiast user?
'Normal enthusiast' is a very obscure term in itself. Readership for me is mostly 'I know how to build a PC, perhaps update a BIOS', but the buck stops there for the majority of people. Sure, the ones that comment on the review are more often than not the more knowledgeable, but as always they could represent the vast minority of the readership.
Imho, a reviewer should at least point out there is a workaround for a certain issue. If not, the reader is not informed correctly.If there is a simple fix that is advertised by the company (or at least distributed), then yes it gets included. I wholeheartedly agree that manufacturers have to be aggressive, and with the popular kits they really do fine tune it in with detail rather than SPD. They are more than welcome to do that. Reality is that the vast majority of regular users do not update the BIOS either, to which I sometimes come to blows with manufacturers when it comes to updating BIOSes.
(For ROG/OC/gaming boards then yes, if it arrived with pre-release BIOS, then I update to the latest. If a retail sample arrives, I'll leave the BIOS as is and work with that, based on the readership of the website.)
But truth be told, each motherboard manufacturer has preferred memory vendors. Corsair and Kingston work with everyone because they have the majority of channel sales. GSkill is getting there in the enthusiast segment, but it is up to the motherboard manufacturers to prioritise who gets research time.
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By any chance can you try it in a MV G/E/F ?
Not got those in, sorry
loosen tRRD, tRRSR and tWWSR, it's too tight on Gigabyte. Boards should be able to do the same as the ASUS ones...That's for Gigabyte to decide on how they recognise their kits. Shouldn't have to go around fiddling with settings 99.99% of people don't understand. Set the strap and go - if the board works then great, if not then too bad, really. I do sense the folly of saying that on an OC forum, but as I review from the perspective of the 'normal enthusiast' user, we're lucky XMP is even set sometimes, let alone XMP then strap as required.
Let's be honest though, GSkill isn't a preferred vendor for Gigabyte. Corsair and Kingston get top priorities, then it filters down. Don't get me wrong, they still work with each other, but in general the later the BIOS the better it seems to work with my kits. In my experience, anyhow - YMMV
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My CPU (Malay ES) with that kit can boot 2800 in a P8Z77-V Pro, but can't in a UD3H.
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Ticket ID: 1548
Priority: Medium
Request to merge motherboard categories.\r\n\r\nThe Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H and Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H-WB-Wifi are both the same model, but the latter has wifi included in the box.\r\n\r\nSimilarly, the Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H and Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H-WB-Wifi are only different by the box contents of the motherboards.\r\n\r\nTa.
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There is also one other option. Members of the Enthusiast League also have an Overclockers league ranking. So my 4th place with 583.7 Enthusiast League points would put me 156th in the OC league. But in the OC league it would count any WR points I would have, and my name would have a * beside it to indicate that I was still in the Enthusiast League.
If the site is coded the way I think it is, then it should be an easy enough change. Then again, I know MM has mountains of changes + updates to process.
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I think the issue is some want to have the big points, yet want to stay in the same league... Coz they rock there and might be blown away ( due to so called limited resources aka fundings, etc ) in another "higher" skilled league.
My point of view : If they want the big points, then it's time to step up and join the rest of us ... if they have the skill now for maxing out air or water clocks, then they can easily master more extreme cooling too... Probably this post will start another whining chime about the costs of LN2...
The enthousiast league is partly an intro to the lovely world of overclocking, as you can post eg decent scores on air/boxed cooling solutions. If you want to be in the top, it's cash out time ( it's enevitable) : maybe get an airco to cool things extra down or move to a country with chilly temperatures,... But soon you will be maxing out and want more, then it's time to move to another league... I would rather see single GPU action only in the enthousiast league (as that's one of the points of some of the thread starters, those that reached high scores with multi GPU setups. Costing an arm and a legg due to the multitude of waterblocks.) as that will reduce the cost factor by far...
You misunderstand our perspective quite spectacularly.
We are happy with the scores we get on air and water. This is our method of competition. A lot of us could make the leap to LN2 but choose not to - air and water is our field of play and we enjoy competing against others on a more-or-less even playing field and getting those 3DMark scores as we can.
But by action, the Enthusiast league is separated from the OC league by cooling method, not by skill or experience. This is fundamental to any statement. Even if contrary to what has been written, by action those are the results and HWBot does have to deal with them that way.
Either let those who want to participate on air/water compete like-for-like (similar to Division 2 football or Formula 3000) similar to sub-zero (Premiership/F1), or rewrite the rules stating that members are only part of the enthusiast league up to a certain time, then move automatically if six months have passed between their first and last submission.
I will repeat, regardless of anything written or said, by action the leagues are split purely on cooling. Thus those are the separations. If someone can build a new system on air and water that hits the top 10 (usually during the initial phase of the launch when other users have not tried or prepped for sub-zero yet) then they should be entitled to the goodies there-in as it falls under the actual segregation as imposed by the division of the leagues. Chances are WR points will happen infrequently (as mentioned, usually at beginning of launches of monster GPUs), but they will happen.
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Long thread, can't believe I didn't see it. Perhaps I should look at the forums more often
I've read through, and there are two clear issues regarding the Enthusiast League and the OC League.
(a) The leagues are currently divided purely on cooling.
(b) However the prevailing opinion is that the leagues should be divided on skill.
You should have the foundation of the league the same.
Thus if it is to be based on cooling, then the people should be able to push that cooling to the limit. I enjoy the challenge of knowing that my fellow competitors in the Enthusiast league also have that limitation as I am unable to put any of my kit under cold for various reasons.
If it should be based on skill, then we have to change the conditions by which people move up to the OC League. Either based on time, number of submissions, or total points. E.g. >500pts, in the OC League. or 50+ submissions, in the OC League. Or 6+ months gone by, in the OC League.
Please make a decisive decision either way, otherwise this will crop up every now and again. Decide once and for all whether the Enthusiast league is for people who want to battle it out on air and water only against those who are also only using air and water, or if the enthusiast league is for the initial introduction period on HWBot.
Personally, I'm for the first option - Enthusiast League by definition is air and water only. That is how it should be decided. If you can get obscene scores and WR points from air and water, then so be it. You still need a large amount of skill (popiromiro) (or cash (Dead Things), or both) to get to the top of this league. It's not just for new people. Some people stick to lower class formula because they like the feel and the challenge that it presents, rather than outright speed. This is how the league has been defined (even if not by words, then by pure action by segregation) and how I believe it should continue.
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Please re-read SuperPi rules to get the proper screenshot. CPU-Z windows (one for CPU, one for memory), plus the SuperPi score must be the one where it shows all the calculation step timings. Also don't forget to actually write in your score into your submission in the correct format
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Tessellation setting changes are legal for AMD cards as it is an option in CCC. There are many threads about this in the forum, there was a big discussion, and a decision was made. Feel free to post in the forum if you disagree.
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Completely wrong MB model.
CPU-Z:
MB Model : N61Jv
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Should be that you can't edit a score after 48hrs from submission
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"participance is according to the participant’s nationality. Ex: a citizen of Canada can only participate at the America Region Qualifier."
This is an important rule to make sure people know about. If you hold an American passport but live in EU/Asia, you have to participate in this qualifier.
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So bonanza continues
http://hwbot.org/submission/2271768_dhenzjhen_pcmark_2005_2x_opteron_6272_5494_marks
No overclock...no tweak...memory relax.
I really can not understand, sorry, but looks like is not important to overclock.
Just run
If the boot was on the other foot your attitude would change
Do you not read anything in this thread? Are you so single minded all you want to do is complain?
People choose to compete in whatever category they like. If you don't like it, then either SUGGEST IMPROVEMENT or go find excitement in your life.
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Insulation ftw
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My results on that kit are ok. At normal voltage, not a lot above rated - wouldn't budge on timings at 2400 9-11-11, will do 2500 though. The XMP doesn't always work, I've tried on a lot of boards. GSkill tried to make one profile XMP 1.2 and the other 1.3, but for some reason both of mine are 1.3
That being said, when they work, I can't complain :thumb: -
Looking good
That post needs its own thread! -
You need three things to do well:
a) Understand (and be good at) benchmarking
b) Understand how the leagues work
c) Exploit what you have got and can afford
sergiorb, if you can do a), b) and c), then you can get a lot of points
People complain mainly because they do not have b) or c)
A lot of benchmarking is knowledge rather than skill - knowledge to understand where the points are.
You could put a lot of time into a GTX580 and get a few points, or use that money to buy a 4870X2 and get more points. It's up to you how you spend your money and how you use it. If you use it to get hardware that has little competition, that is up to you.
So if you buy obscure hardware that costs a lot, that gets you points
If you buy cheaper hardware but put effort in with cooling, that could also get you points
Just because you do one and someone else does the other does not mean that is a problem. If you think it is a problem, make suggestions rather than point fingers. Perhaps you should read this bug, which was mentioned in another thread about exactly this issue:
http://bugs.hwbot.org/browse/HWBOT-694
As expected, the min_points=60 rule for UGP categories has made it possible to dominate rankings by simply running very obscure hardware.http://hwbot.org/league/enthusiast
Dead Things is now #1 of the Enthusiast League mainly by hitting the #1 spots in multithreaded benchmarks with his stock clocked single, dual and quad 10-core cpus. That brings 60p x 3 (config) x 3 (benchmarks) for just having the hardware. In these categories, there's almost no competition.
I think we should have implemented the variable min_points from the start. This is suggested by a member and seems good.
- 10pts for a global with 10 or less submissions
- 20pts for 10-20 subs
- 30pts for 20-30 subs
- 40pts for 30-40
- 50pts for 40-50
- 60pts for 51+
If there is something you do not understand, then ask. If there is something you want to change, then suggest!
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Are you turning tessellation off? I just beat this by about 20 points with lower GPU clocks (same CPU near enough).
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Hi all, MM
Just wondered if it would be possible to get a screen up with country records. So I can see 1x GPU results for UK for all the 3D benchmarks, all the 2x, all the 3x.
Make it like a hardware page, showing each benchmark, 1x 2x 3x etc, but instead of team record, show country record.
Ta
PS Would have been easy to sort out with an API
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I've heard that Intel are reluctant to make SB-E look terrible.... which is what we all know full-speed Ivy WILL do...
Break out your OC keys and EVBots for Vantage. high 6.x for GPU tests, low 6.x for CPU tests perhaps.
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Put back to 1x i7 950
You have 8 threads but only one CPU. That x number is for multi CPU systems. -
Reading the white paper for MVP, there are various easy tweaks to get an even better score boost, making MVP seemingly useless for benchmarking. I will have to test to see if my suspicions are correct.
HWBOT Memebase
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Learned today I have the same b'day as Vince...