M.Beier Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 I honestly think the three following scores should never have been approved: http://hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=906442 http://hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=906443 http://hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=906445 I think its completely lame to see no#1 in hall of fame listing, correct, it doesnt give points, but it gives #1 in global ranking..... FOR results on hardware that wont be public availible in year 2009.... Why the heck isnt the other decent and HONEST results #1 While Im at it; I think the 3Dmark2006 result isnt anywhere near good, and the performance product of the 32M sucks compared to Stummerwinter who has the VALID and true #1 spot... (Dispite the larger shared cache, which should yield better CPC performance in 32M) Dont get me wrong; AndreYang has made some very good results, but its truely disgraceful to submit results of none released hardware on the worlds leading benchmark competition site... Why does AndreYang have priveledge to be #1 untruth while other doesnt? Beyond doubt there is more then 3 results in each of the categories with better scores, difference is; They have signed a NDA, and stick to that NDA.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Beier Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 ... This is my opinion... Please note AndreYang; If you read the thread, nothing against you.... I dont like that such scores can be accepted... I dont like when FM approves scores with pre-released HW... I made a huge fuss about this on XS at both C2D 65nm and 45nm launch.... Besides, without knowing it; I doubt you have violated any NDA. EDIT: Dropped last line regarding NDA... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Most people are interested in Gulftown benches, but since they are not avaliable to the public, they don't get boints. Fair enough. But they do deserve a place on top of some list, as those scores are indeed the best ones out there. There are two different lists, actually - one for overall records, and one for "boint scores" only. So the lists you're asking for do exists... here: http://hwbot.org/hallOfFame.do?type=result&applicationId=5 Click on 3dmark05 top score on the front page and you'll get there. Why the overall record list links to the boint list... is something I can't explain;) PS: you can't really compare scores made with EARLY BIOSes to a platform where the BIOSes are much more mature. Maybe these chips have other challenges than Nehalem. I don't know, I'm just saying "what if":p Maybe you have one and know better? (Or maybe he just posted some random tease run.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreYang Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 (edited) what's NDA? lol I never sign any shi(t) NDA from Intel. New tech hardware doesn't have any point for hwbot. What's your point here? So many guys show off WR with unrelease hardware and submit it before. Did you say something about them before? Some guys submit Mars score before they are available. Did you post something about them? I don't mind if hwbot wants to remove new tech score. It's not really a big deal for me. Edited November 15, 2009 by AndreYang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monstru Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 Marc - those scores do not count in rankings, they count as WR's. They do not get points, but they are there so people can see the actual WR, even if it is done with unreleased hardware. It is the manufacturers fault to leak or allow leaking of so many unreleased hardware sample with months before the actual launch, not the guys using them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
komadyret Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 I'm with Knopflerbruce on this. It should be visible but no points. The results/lists could maybe be formated and accessible in a different way, but todays policy of showing off but no points are good imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol'Bud Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 should be a third category, of no points no ranking against items available to the public through retail channels. That would stop the belly aching fast. And let the ones who get the engineering samples continue to post the results they get so all can see the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 what's NDA? lol I never sign any shi(t) NDA from Intel. New tech hardware doesn't have any point for hwbot. What's your point here? So many guys show off WR with unrelease hardware and submit it before. Did you say something about them before? Some guys submit Mars score before they are available. Did you post something about them? I don't mind if hwbot wants to remove new tech score. It's not really a big deal for me. Not going to happen;) We had a discussion on how to deal with this and the solution we came up with is very good. No boints, because of HW not being available to most benchers, but it still needs to be listed as they're still benchmark results (which is what HWBot is all about). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Beier Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 I remain in the opinion; Its completely lame and disgraceful that when you go to "world record" you get to see these results... I think they should be completely removed, however #7 solution makes sense, hide away the scores from the MAIN list, the sublist you mentioned, guys, you have the figures of hits per page, I dont, can you honestly tell me that many people knows about that "hidden" list and checks it??? #4 Andre I dont spot everything, personally, since the P5E3 / P5K3 I havent seen any ASUS motherboard that I like, the graphics is another matter.... I dont feel that Im missing out on anything, read about the P7-55 "supercomputer", what I noticed was no retail chips above 220bclk, once again; dont feel that Im missing out on nothing. Regarding if I said something before; I suggest you reading Hipro5s thread on XS (You already made comments in it...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crew Vivi Posted November 15, 2009 Crew Share Posted November 15, 2009 i agree with m.beier , yes its a world record, but let it show on futuremark's website, not on an overclockers league website. This is a competition isnt it. I have full respect for andre, hell i love the guy The huge scores are staring us in the face, drowning our ambition to try and break current legal world records that wont stand a chance as soon as i9 is legalized for Hwbot. People are already selling some of their gear to save money for i9 leading to less hwbot submissions. I'm not talking about myself though, im so damn excited about my 975 gulftowns wont deminish me eventhough they will ravage any 975 scores. The i9 scores should be visible when you click on world records, but they shouldnt show under the World Records banner on the front page. (the country flag with the score). Because it's marketing meterial for the guys using current legal hardware to break world records to email Brands asking for sponsors and stuff like that. It's also a privelage and an honor to wave your country flag on the front page. I still respect any descision made by hwbot. but it should be considered what m.beier said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richba5tard Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 The "world records" page is not an overclockers league, it's exactly what it's says: world records. These kind of submissions are excluded from any other ranking, points or cups. But not the world records. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol'Bud Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 i agree with m.beier , yes its a world record, but let it show on futuremark's website, not on an overclockers league website. This is a competition isnt it. I have full respect for andre, hell i love the guy The huge scores are staring us in the face, drowning our ambition to try and break current legal world records that wont stand a chance as soon as i9 is legalized for Hwbot. People are already selling some of their gear to save money for i9 leading to less hwbot submissions. I'm not talking about myself though, im so damn excited about my 975 gulftowns wont deminish me eventhough they will ravage any 975 scores. The i9 scores should be visible when you click on world records, but they shouldnt show under the World Records banner on the front page. (the country flag with the score). Because it's marketing meterial for the guys using current legal hardware to break world records to email Brands asking for sponsors and stuff like that. It's also a privelage and an honor to wave your country flag on the front page. I still respect any descision made by hwbot. but it should be considered what m.beier said Ditto It should be on the futuremark / ORB site not here. Mr.Clarke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted November 15, 2009 Share Posted November 15, 2009 An overclocking database where scores made with proper software and validation aren't allowed:woot: Wohooo! We have a rank for those who don't like unreleased hardware... if you don't like the "everything allowed" list - don't look at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Beier Posted November 16, 2009 Author Share Posted November 16, 2009 (edited) I personally dont want to see it on hwbot, but, that might not be realistic... And I dont because its for competition.... Heck, I dont know if Boris (Stummerwinter) has gulftown, being invited to Cebit for overclocking etc, I'd say pretty high odds he has.... The guy uses a shite-load of cash on HW, so does many other benchers and topbenchers, I think they deserve credit for their hard work, not just being ran over by some unapproved result... (Unapproved since not released HW.... And while we are at it; TWKR shouldnt give boints at all....) However, going more realistic, it would be good, atleast a bit more satisfying IF the valid-only is easiest accessible, while the "super-duper-nextgen-hw" is in a section you actually have to search for... The ones that WANTS to see nextgen HW results will probably spend time looking for it???? Will the marketing person spend time looking for the valid list, that reveals the skills? Answer is simple; NO, especially since the publicity is less.. Seriously; HWbot should live up to the responsibility and impact that it has on this matter, its for competition, show the spirit of sport, embrace the ones that play by the rules, and let them get the credit they deserve... Example... From 2008 Cebit, all marketing staff at Enermax asked one question to the powerusers arriving; "What is your HWBot rank", if already in 2008 marketing for companies had eyes open for HWBot, what then by end 2009?? HWBot has became a big contender in the show - do the honor of condoling the sport, not demolishing... My 50 cents, I rest my case, and can only hope HWBot staff will open this for discussion again... EDIT: Knopflerbruce; If I have Gulftown or not is not of importance, but no I dont have one :-) Monstru; Sure, but, its BIASED you know that man, PUBLICLY; Hipro5 has posted scores on XS which are better... Unofficially myths are that neither of the scores are the higher, its not WR on any level..... Its not WR on upcoming HW, as some people keep shut about their results, its not WR on current HW..... Its basicly; Who is allowed? AndreYang, Coolaler and a few others are "allowed", others have paper signed "Be quiet or get ur arse whooped"... We have SEEN on XS how Drwho "Francois", is commenting on the early release of results.... Alike, I see weekly same thing happening on facebook.... Latest 15th November on pt1t's release of Clarkdale booting at 5.6ghz (or 5.8ghz, cant rememeber)... EDIT2: Yeah, you are completely right, its the manuf fault, but its the other benchers who are being punished... Edited November 16, 2009 by M.Beier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted November 16, 2009 Share Posted November 16, 2009 Don't make an elephant from a fly ... by just adding those scores to the list we're not "demolishing" OC. If anything, you should be mad at Intel for allowing samples this early get away. Remember: this issue can only occur if Intel (or AMD for that matter) allows their engineering samples to go out in public. By the way, the fact that they show up the world records page is because they get the same status as any other "non-hwboint"-ed score. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crew Vivi Posted November 16, 2009 Crew Share Posted November 16, 2009 You're points are valid mass and jmke, and i respect that. i've made peace with the fact that they should show. BUT not as HWbot world records. HWbot should have a World Record page yes, but it shouldnt be Called HWBOT world recrods, it should be called World Records. see below: is what we see here in this image HWBOT world records (a.k.a official hwbot Valid wr's with current hware) or WORLD RECORDS in general. cause if it was wr's in general Hipro 5's superpi 1m score should be shown and ducks 8.2ghz with the Japanese flag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crew Vivi Posted November 16, 2009 Crew Share Posted November 16, 2009 haha jmke . true true Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted November 16, 2009 Share Posted November 16, 2009 I also think HWbot Records deserves a spot in the main top bar, replacing the "search" button he search button is handy, at least don't delete it:p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnip Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 You're points are valid mass and jmke, and i respect that. i've made peace with the fact that they should show. BUT not as HWbot world records. HWbot should have a World Record page yes, but it shouldnt be Called HWBOT world recrods, it should be called World Records. see below: is what we see here in this image HWBOT world records (a.k.a official hwbot Valid wr's with current hware) or WORLD RECORDS in general. cause if it was wr's in general Hipro 5's superpi 1m score should be shown and ducks 8.2ghz with the Japanese flag +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.