Sweet
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Posts posted by Sweet
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I know C. Ney very long time, He is a good overclocker and person, He will block his score, is he has been used any cheats.
Sorry i'm in my Job. come back later
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Ok, i beginn to delete, but this will took some time
But i want to see, that Christian Ney, Pro and so on will all do this!
Pro (yougpro in XS) is the real judge who will audit each tweak is made and tell if cheat or tweak, he deleted their submissions.
Please send to him any tweaks, in which doubt.
CN is part of staff, is a moderator, and if have used any cheat, he will block
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When the screen goes blanck in 3D, its a bug or something else, not a software, instead it would be a cheat in 3D if anyone use a software
Like write before because you are using software to improve the score, and is not allowed. These rules were published in 2008 and known to all
Guys, its easy, enforce rules that are from 2008 and do not ruin a benchmark #no human interaction or software or change codecs or files in Benchmark#, and this will always be so.
Thats all
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In computing, a virtual desktop is a term used with respect to user interfaces, usually within the WIMP paradigm, to describe ways in which the virtual space of a computer's desktop environment is expanded beyond the physical limits of the screen's real estate through the use of software
I know that all knows this, but is important remember
* - any software or human interaction altering the perceived speed of the benchmark program, tricking it to believe it ran faster -
Ok than i leave flash 2 Desktop scores till decission.
So...we will block this
Flash Desktops is the first REAL TIME "virtual" desktop managerHere in Hwbot, we do overclocking right in a real storage system like Hdd, ssd, revodrives, and more, but this is real, like a processor or mainboard or a real windows install in the storage.
Overclocking is real not virtual
Then, Flash 2 Desktop is "not allowed"
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Ok but what about flash 2 Desktop? I need to know it for delete some scores;)
Moose you and the others guys who have used these cheats know what is right and what is wrong in each submission made .
Flash 2 Desktop "by now" isnt allowed, in the staff no conclusions about this
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in this link we can continue talking about the cheats, the tweaks (honest) here
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This post will be updated periodically
3. Tweaks and cheats
A big part of the benchmarking process is setting up your operating system to be as fast as possible in the benchmark you want to run. Stripping down to the bare minimum, messing with the registry settings or changing the video card drivers from ‘quality’ to ‘performance’, these are all more than legit tweaks. A tweak is what can be considered as a manual change in system settings to increase the performance, which in the end affects your benchmark result positively. Not all tweaks are to be used in 24/7 setups as they might decrease performance for your daily applications or even limit you in what you can do.
However, where there’s competition, there are cheaters! HWBot will not allow people to cheat their way to higher scores leaving less honor and/or points for those who play fair. Therefor, we try to be as clear and strict as possible when it comes to cheaters: we block the score instantly. Depending on the cheat used and the motivation behind the cheat, we can also ban the member.
What do we consider as severe cheating (instant ban):
- Submitting scores that belong to other people
- Using software, performing hardware modifications or by human interaction altering the perceived speed of the benchmark program, tricking it to believe it ran faster and thus producing a better result. (adjusted 31st of August 2010)
- Using a program to edit screenshots to have more points
What do we consider as illegal tweaks (instant block):
- PhysX enabled drivers
- Mipmap (either through software or registry)
- Using a program to launch your benchmark, unless officially approved by HWBOT; benchmarks must always be launched using the shortcuts found in the installation directory.
- Software based ramdrives
Update 17th March 2010: Any software or human interaction causing the benchmark application to fail to (properly) render the textures or making the rendered image to differ too much from the original due to other software tweaking
Update 20th July 2010: Any software or human interaction causing the benchmark to use different calculation algorithms as intended by the original software creator. E.g. replacing the codec or browser in PCMark2005.
At HWBot, we are all for sharing information such as tweaks, voltage modifications and many more. However, we do understand that certain tweaks are rather kept silent because it gives a small advantage over the competition, which can come in handy when competing for that special golden cup. If questions are raised about a certain score or a series of scores, we strongly suggest trying to clear the air as fast as possible; not because of HWBot or any other member, but to prevent you from getting a bad name in the community (even if you don’t deserve it!). From past experience, we know that when serious questions are raised regarding the legitimacy of a score or overclocker, it’s always best to choose the honorable path by for instance explaining a few tricks or even removing the questioned score from HWBot.If you are uncertain about the validity of a tweak/cheat, you can always contact one of the crew members. The tweak/cheat will be tested and discussed and you will receive an answer categorized as legit/not legit. If you don’t want the tweak to be leaked, no problem: we guarantee that the tweak will only be shared with those who took part in the evaluation.
24/10/2012 time to put things in order (Thanks Pro)
okay guys let me weigh in on this,
my position
firstly im waiting for all my scores to be removed and i will not submit pcmark scores to hwbot anymore, most of my scores feature totally legitimate tweaks, some scores have things like transparent windows with resized windows that we have worked out is not allowed. the main reason i am removing my scores is so i can stay objective in decision making and no one thinks that i am using their tweaks against them... and just to clarify im not using any tweaks that are replacing benchmark files, so if your doing that, your doing it wrong
ill always bench pcm05 privately though as i love the benchmark
why keep pcm05?
for those that are saying "get rid of pcm05", we are basically at that point and i am sure if this doesnt work then that is what will happen, but there are lots of reasons to keep this benchmark, for example,
we have guys like Steve and Aristides that are always strong in this bench and are getting beaten by tweaks that they are not comfortable using and rightly so, this benchmark has a place and is a source of enjoyment for lots of people, so i believe we should have a proper effort to try and fix it up before abandoning it
please be patient
now guys i see lots of people saying, whys this not banned, why is mine banned and not his, etc, please be patient, this will takes weeks, months, and will be ongoing, but it is no different than any other benchmark, other than the fact it has gone unchecked for so long.. if this happened in 3dmark11 it would be immediately checked and in the future pcmark05 will be the same
what is allowed and whats not?
lets get something cleared up, a cheat is not a super-tweak, i WOULD call bobs TW a supertweak, i would call replacing codecs in a benchmark cheating, if it pleases you, then call it a super-cheat, whatever, but if its outside the rules its not a tweak, and i am just as much to blame for things like TW window resizing as anyone else benching PCM,
now lets get onto the juicy stuff, whats allowed and whats not, this is extremely simple, lets go back to two very basic hwbot rules,
1. "Using software, performing hardware modifications or by human interaction altering the perceived speed of the benchmark program, tricking it to believe it ran faster and thus producing a better result. (adjusted 31st of August 2010)"
2. not modifying the benchmark itself
Yes d3d, video encoding via registry or powertoy and LOD go against these rules, BUT they have been used and accepted as officially OK, unless staff have specifically said something is allowed that goes against HWBOTs general rules then it is NOT allowed
if what you are doing in pcmark05 goes against one of those 2 rules, remove it now. staff will be contacting users with out of line submissions asking for proof on how to replicate them within the rules, if you are worried you cant provide that proof, remove your score now or it will be removed for you
use your brain guys, if you know something is not right, 2400MB/s virusscan on a weak AMD platform, then its probably not right, this is the ethical side of hwbot we can't enforce but hope is in place
Key areas we are targeting to start with
Some of the key areas we will be targeting, but not limited to:
Video encoding replacement, audio encoding
Irregularly large trans windows
Irregularly large memory latency
Massive browser scores
Anything out of line with file decoding
Crazy virusscans or hdd general
What is OK
I am not going to go through every tweak and say its ok or its not ok, thats what the general rules are for and they cover alot of the "super tweaks", but not all,
FD2 as a program is totally allowed, but using it to manipulate the window size or minimize windows is not allowed, similarly using a script to do this is not allowed as it breaks the "benchmark percieved speed rule"
BUT as with any benchmark, if you can do it via control panel such as personalization or registry then it SHOULD be allowed, but there are always exceptions to the rule such as MIPMAP and in the future there might be other exceptions, but this is the current position, there is no one rule fits all model
so take TW for example, if you can make the windows really small and change the text type in control panel then that is legal,
SCRIPTS ARE LEGAL, i use scripts in nearly every benchmark, but to do things like control cpu clock, change gpu clocks on the fly, and to change things like the drives for different harddrive during PCMARK, that is all OK
Using a script to do something that goes against the general rules is NOT ok. For example replacing a file that the benchmark uses to make TE go faster, NOT OK.
Things like codecs can be tricky, as microsoft may update them or another program installed for watching videos may influence the scores, this is not the case in PCM05,
if you are putting codecs specially in the pcm05 directory or replacing codecs that pcm05 installs, this is definatly NOT OK, i think that is common sense
also forcing pcm05 to look in a folder it doesnt normally so it uses your codec, not OK, again common sense,
guys you get the drift right? if it breaks hwbot general rules then it is NOT OK
Raid XPERT
Still up in the air is raid xpert, we are discussing the outcome of this one right now, there and positives and negatives to both sides of the fence and we need to make sure everything is worked out properly
Massman said it was allowed, but now that we are aware that their is some bugging going on, we are reviewing it.
We don't want peoples expensive raid setups obsoleted by a bugged software,
Fairness
This is not a witch hunt, everyone will be given the oppurtunity to prove their tweak is fair in a confidential environment. If you tweak is legitimate, it won't be shared, it will be approved and you can continue using it privately if you so wish.
If you choose to not share the tweak with staff and your score looks out of line then it will be removed.
Lets hope we can clean the benchmark up once and for all, remember guys, please use your brain, we dont want to remove scores, so please do it yourself if you know they go against rules
http://hwbot.org/forum/showpost.php?p=205405&postcount=122
oh and of course, the ie9 css is not allowed, there is really no difference between replacing the web files and doing that CSS,
the benchmark is no longer rendering the data that it was designed to render, hence skewing the results,
so just to clarify IE9 CSS is not allowed
http://hwbot.org/forum/showpost.php?p=205643&postcount=167
synthesis and to take into account
This list will be updated periodically (thanks borandi)
So Tweaks:
Bob80's - YES
Mouse Movement - YES
Resizing windows (F2D or Registry) - NO
IE Settings - YES
AMD RaidXpert - YES (for now, new decision pending, may be retroactively removed)
Changing Codecs in the directory - NO
Changing Codecs outside the directory - (Sweet: i think not by now )
Script to change files for Web Pages - NO
Ie9 CSS software - NO
Script to change files for Text Edit - NO
D3DOverrider - YES
Video Encoding via registry (d3d) - YES
LOD - YES
Other registry tweaks - TO BE DISCUSSED BY ADMINS
Scripts to change drive letters - YES
Scripts to change CPU clock/cores - YES
Forcing PC05 to look in other directories - NO
Audio Encoding via registry (powertoy) - YES
Remember: If it breaks hwbot general rules then it is NOT OK
To all benchers : If you have used this type of tweaks - trick -cheats o supertweak, please delete this submission, and do not use it anymore
Since October 24, 2012 - New (thanks SteveRo)
Until the wrapper are ready
1. Futuremark link -ORB-required for all top 20 submissions global
2. For all non-top 20 submissions either Futuremark link or Pcm05 Results.txt required via screen shot.
3. Include real pictures of your rig, specifically storage and cooling.
This is Mandatory for all submissions in PcMark'05
If you use ORB link, screenshot basic is equally mandatory
Example .txt (thanks zafiropo)
Example Screenshot with .txt (thanks to me
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use default PCMark settings
-Forbidden Software or Hardware:
* - software ramdisk (iRam is allowed)
* - MFT Software
* - ramcache software
Forbidden Tweaks:
* - any software or human interaction altering the perceived speed of the benchmark program, tricking it to believe it ran faster
Human interaction: like change codecs, files , etc. in the benchmark or in the So
Any software: In computing a script, command file or batch file, commonly referred to barbarism script is a program usually simple.
In DOS, OS/2, and also Microsoft Windows, batch file is the name given to a type of script file, a text file containing a series of commands to be executed by the command interpreter.A batch file may contain any command the interpreter accepts interactively at the command prompt. A batch file may also have constructs ( IF, GOTO, Labels, CALL, etc.) that enable conditional branching and looping within the batch file.
Sorry, but this is known to all benchers
The cheats that are running in the PCMark are totally illegal, because it runs a command line "external" to change the end result, I say EXTERNAL (script or command line)
Worse and more illegal is replaced, replace, change files, as is done in the audio compression subtest and WPR (in SO.).
For all benchers : If you have used this type of cheats, please delete this submission, from this day (10/22/2012) do not use anything to replace, modify or replace any file, because I will request "ban for a significant period of time"
On the subject of cheats, I have no friends or team mate, or "the best overclocker" or whatever.I will ask direct ban
From now you can go down (delete) the submissiones that are not in rule
When moderators start delete, there may be collateral damage or the lowering all without discrimination with Cheats or Tweaks.
We have to give an end to this that hurts all benchers and HWBOT.
Today 12 pm we begin to delete the submissions made with cheats in the last 72 Hrs.
in this line, better delete for you, that for moderator, no ?
My apologies, but PcMark should be a benchmark clean again, for ALL overclockers.
Important Note: "The moderation staff no accept claims or complaints about using cheats!"
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Again, before you say cheat, try the stuff crusty allready write
Webpage and TE tweak can be done without replacing anything in the bench! He told exactly how to do.
I insist, it's better now than later delete this cheats, challenge staff members , you and two or three more members, will get sansiones against.
Sorry
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Edit: I can't really tell what has been ruled as invalid lately. Interested in hearing what has changed.
To change or modify files own of the benchmark is cheat, as Text edit, audio compression, WPR, etc
Imo., Meanwhile notification arrives. members who have used the benchmark cheats like modify files either as replacement or modification of files (temporary or not), themselves could go erasing these submissions that are cheats.By the way, Those have many submissiones with cheats, at time of communication, I think proposing punishments, because as Mr.Scott written and others, there are benchers who are already aware that they are cheats and continue to use to this day. 21-10-2012
So...They are NO benchers, are Cheats. Sorry but I think that
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I see more piling up every day.
Imo., Meanwhile notification arrives. members who have used the benchmark cheats like modify files either as replacement or modification of files (temporary or not), themselves could go erasing these submissions that are cheats.
By the way, Those have many submissiones with cheats, at time of communication, I think proposing punishments, because as Mr.Scott written and others, there are benchers who are already aware that they are cheats and continue to use to this day. 21-10-2012
So...They are NO benchers, are Cheats. Sorry but I think that
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Hey, mh, thats actually funny Trading tweaks is an new area in this Bench
I did so also, me like
You Moose better not change (or trade) anything with anyone
I read the news today oh, boyAbout a lucky man who made the grade
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I think I should dedicate more spare time to writing our own System Benchmark
Yes, fully agree, but it takes time and money, something complicated
when the 3rd party has nothing to gain from the disclosed tweak, then the level of trust goes up. Reliance on a wrapper and the determination of if the tweak is legal or not by active benchers still does not resolve the doubt that confidentiality between hwbot and the end user is maintained as there IS an incentive to use XXX tweak after it has been disclosed privately to the staff. there is no way anybody can claim that they are a disinterested party if they are actively benching for points in the same arena as those who are being questioned.its easier for most all other benchmarks with the exception of PCM05 as the trend is to develop a tweak and use it to one's own advantage. once disclosed to staff, the advantage is lost as they also bench (based upon the assumption that a new legal tweak is found.)
/end run-on sentences
Pro, also known yougpro, will be a moderator direct (or better judge) for PCMark'05, is one of the most knowledgeable people of this benchmark, off course the rest of the moderators we will help
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He has explained a tweak in private to a staff member, and that member used it for their own personal gain.
Are you shure of this ?
Moose83 please, explain What has happened to the tricks you consult with staff
Can you explain this ?
Thank you
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No some can done without replacing
Also Audio Compression like TE and the others , thats right ?
For example , upload yesterday
http://hwbot.org/submission/2321638_gluvocio_pcmark_2005_core_2_e8400_(3.0ghz)_76349_marks
http://hwbot.org/submission/2321571_sebro_pcmark_2005_core_i7_2700k_106199_marks
So this is a "cheat" too,
if all these cheats are changing the root of the benchmark, ALL must be removed, thats all my friends
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If a member of staff has used, handled or delivered information outside the staff moderation, is that it has exceeded its authority and failed in the ethics of competition.
Perhaps like others benchers, have developed their own tweak and used in the in PCMark Because the benchmark have serious holes, i think so (so benchers are)
on a side note... why are you knuckleheads (general public) still submitting pcm05 right now? i see two on the front page.Is our fault, By now, PcMark is under serious discussion in the staff, soon many submission will be blocked
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Yep,
I still don't understand how this is called "tweak". You directly mess with the way benchmark is meant to run, in other words - change the calculation. How on earth an (almost) empty file is comparable to the original .rtf which those who don't "tweak" use...
Guys who defend these "tweaks", please have some dignity and look farther than your nose.
There are a lot ot capable guys, who can figure out those "tweaks", but they just don't see the point.
I.nfraR.ed Imho sofos1990 wants to show the same thing that you said, to use this type of things is a cheat, or i'm wrong ?
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the memory size difference may be explained by sysinfo errors either maxmem limit or os settings
Ximi i think TerraRaptor is right in this. I can not say because I dont have a Z77and Ivy yet, but I think this run showing zupernico is right
If you can show me with some proof that bad, would be better
(Spanish) Ximi creo que lo que menciona TerraRaptor es correcto, no puedo asegurarlo porque todavía no tengo una z77 y un Ivy, pero me parece que esta corrida que muestra zupernico esta bien.
Si puedes mostrarme con alguna prueba que esta mal, sería mejor
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Guys in this world, anywhere in the world, there are people who can easily develop a cheat to any benchmark, but that's not right in the overclocking, this is a cheat
there is no king of software these days, any overclocker can develop a cheat to modify the final score, some overclockers have done this in my country., but dont use this because they think is illegal, like in Brasil and anothers countrys.
I say Cheat i use that word too knut
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Trust me. We use exactly the same way for TE. 0 characters in the temp file. You just set more than 0 so you have a worse score...or if it's not exactly the same it's almost the same.
.rft in blank go to infinite
Thats why is illegal, you modifie temps files in the benchmark
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Sorry Voiager, but subtest are mandatory in the screen
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mabye the staff shouldnt be awarded points? this would make them referees instead of opponents.... or mabye a dedicated staff member that does not participate in points
Not bad, can be a good idea, I will be moving this idea to the discussion in the staff
(also another potential problem as "word of mouth" seems to be fairly common around here)I dont think so, staff members can not commentate anything that is discussed internally, as it is a moral and ethical obligation to which we all subscribe.
I do not think we should use the knowledge of the tweaks to benefit or gain points....
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@sofos1990
The girl in your wallpaper to the right side., improve your score, that girl is not allowed, by now, only by now
Clarification in PCMark'05 about Tweaks // Tricks allowed
in Benchmark software
Posted · Edited by Sweet
Yes, thats right
Thanks SamOCX. i'm in my job, and I think I should get to work, many have asked me, what are you doing?