harleybro Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 I know this was discussed and said it wasn't allowed. I tried to find where it was posted before. I have been looking through this teams scores http://www.hwbot.org/teamInfo.do?teamId=1546 and it appears there might be some sharing of HW. Today I came across results that almost definately point towards it. There are a few members on this team moving up ranks quickly with GTX and Ultra results. Here's the 01 runs that seem just a little too odd. Identical mobo's identical cpu both LN2 runs and both submitted within 10 minutes of each other? The only thing that changes is the graphics card. Scan date: 11-08-2007 01:19 http://www.hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=633206 Scan date: 11-08-2007 01:28 http://www.hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=633214 Now for 03: Scan date: 11-08-2007 01:24 http://www.hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=633211 Scan date: 11-08-2007 01:30 http://www.hwbot.org/compare.do?resultId=633216 Then just checking member by member you will find a few members with an X6800 result for say super pi but never use that for 3d benching? Just many similar results and hardware similarities IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulxmn Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 It has become apparent that sharing hardware and FutureMark accounts has become the accepted norm at hwbot.org. The obsession by both teams and their members (to attain scores) has reached the point that the administrators have to decide on the future course and intent of this site. Administration and policing the site requires effort,time and expenses. hwbot.org like any public site that provides a service requires financial assitance and income. All of us have invested in our hardware to enjoy this "hobby" based on what we can achieve as individuals and contribute towards a team effort. An annual individual membership fee should be proposed by hwbot.org to provide the resources to facilitate the site, monitor and police the submissions. The alternative to this will be the continued deterioration of the site's validity resulting in "no credible standing" of the Top Teams score's. Being in the top ten on a site with "manipulated scores" will mean "nothing". Even as an individual in my ranking any pride or sense of accomplishment I achieve for "myself alone" will be diminished and the question to mind "why bother to post at all". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Maybe we should do a poll, but I'm afraid that would only scare people away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richba5tard Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Guys, even if every member paid 5$ a year, hwbot could barely support one full time person. Even if we had one full time person which keeps an eye on everything, it's nearly impossible to have a sport without people trying to breach the rules. Heck, the FM Orb has a full time guy which keeps eye on the database, and there are more faulty results in the FM orb than on hwbot. Making people pay for hwbot is neither an option or a solution. Trying to bend/break the rules in a contest is part of the human gene. We will try to prevent it as much as possible, but don't expect any contest/sport (of a reasonable size) ever to be free of cheating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harleybro Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 HWbot is not expected to be free of cheating but when rules are posted and a member brings something like this up it should be looked into. Maybe the way to resolve it is to make punishments more severe. A temporary account ban or permanent ban of a member caught cheating would be a good way to curb the desire to cheat. If nothing is done then it leads the members to believe that noone cares and they will continue to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 HWbot is not expected to be free of cheating but when rules are posted and a member brings something like this up it should be looked into. Maybe the way to resolve it is to make punishments more severe. A temporary account ban or permanent ban of a member caught cheating would be a good way to curb the desire to cheat. If nothing is done then it leads the members to believe that noone cares and they will continue to do so. I can give you a list of all the members who have been banned already, but that's not going to help, is it? Don't think because we don't ban in public that we don't ban at all. We just don't want to blow things up too much. Not every wrong entry is a cheat and we can only ban if we're 100% sure. Every report is taking into account and most of the reports we get from people who notice another teams/members bending the rules too much is mostly posted on the crew forums before we get the PM/mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harleybro Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 I can give you a list of all the members who have been banned already, but that's not going to help, is it? Don't think because we don't ban in public that we don't ban at all. We just don't want to blow things up too much. Not every wrong entry is a cheat and we can only ban if we're 100% sure. No of coarse that isn't going to help. I am sure you do ban and for good reasons and also in public isn't a good idea unless there is an uproar. Also I know not every wrong entry is a cheat. I for one posted an 06 score that seemed ridiculously high. Not until later that day or the following did I realize it was due to the 15" monitor and running the test at the wrong res. I immediately pulled the score so yeah accidents do happen. jmke: Sorry if I came off sounding harsh. I don't mean disrespect to you or any of you guys that put hard work into the site. I have put many hours into benching the GTX I am working with to get up near the top. Starting on water with CPU on LN2 then going to vmodded on water adjusting shaders and playing around with various tweaks. Then brief testing with LN2 all while blowing through maybe 500L of LN2 and to see someone come along who appears to be obviously benching on a loaner rig while his friend is standing next to him telling him what works best well that's what gets me. For the guys on the team that work hard to get where we are and yet watch another team breeze up the ranks with what is very likely shared hardware can be a little disheartening. So once again sorry if my posts seem menacing I guess it's just the easiest way for me to pass along my frustration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxi Posted August 15, 2007 Share Posted August 15, 2007 No need to apologize harley I happen to agree with you 100%. HWBot did not until recently create clearer rules governing Team sharing and is working hard (and have been) to create the fairest benching & scoring system out there. Suffice it to say that we are looking at this situation closely. We do appreciate your input on this. maxi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harleybro Posted August 22, 2007 Author Share Posted August 22, 2007 Thanks Maxi! I just figured I would pop by and see if there has been any progress made? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.