The Poll: Allow E.S. or disallow ?

[Patch]

There are many places to share and enjoy cutting edge extreme overclocking accomplishments. To my knowledge, hwbot is the only place that AWARDS POINTS for a completely open world wide competition to compare against each other.

 

Not everyone who overclocks posts and competes here. Some of the most skilled don't.

 

I like submitting here to compare myself against others and compete. It's fun.

 

All the much vaunted "skill" talk I hear is nothing more than practice that turns into experience, coupled with access to hardware and a willingness to kill it. And life ain't fair. A completely fair world would simply mean holding back high achievers in favor of the apathetic, less competent, or lazy.

 

If hwbot continues to accept ES, that's fine. I'll keep trying to obtain whatever hardware necessary to push the limits. That's just part of the game. If Intel truly cared, they'd just ask for them back and prosecute if not delivered.

 

But if you're asking whether it SHOULD accept ES, I still say no. By using them we are either stealing or using someone else's (Intel's) hardware.

 

From Intel:

 

 

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[steponz]

So far 25 to seperate and 5 to keep...

Looks like the community is talking...

[Don_Dan]

It doesn't matter Bill. If you disallow ESes, there will just be corporate retail binning. It won't change a thing.

 

This.

 

People need to realize ES processors are not the problem...

[Kal-EL]

This.

 

People need to realize ES processors are not the problem...

 

Whats the problem?

[Hondacity]

just voted....

 

clockers vote please...

 

thanks

 

 

**es videocards ...............................fucking advantage with (vid chips) is almost a cheat...we can't get them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mafio]

voted

 

There is a great number of talented and knowledgeable overclockers out there more than capable of achieving those clocks with the same hardware. These same talented overclockers do not have the privilege of the cold bug fixed provided by some manufacturers and nvidia.

 

+1

 

these days overclocking isn't question of skills, it's more a question of connection with manufacturers etc etc

there are a big number of people that have the skills for doing at least the same score of the top overclockers but don't have tons of free hw...

[$@39@]

I votted. The best for all o/cers around the world and not just few of them... Hope all vote the same.

[Hollywood]

Forgot something b4 about the GT ES chips:

Only thing that need's to be changed, imo, is to not give hwboints in 2D rankings because they don't fit in the 980x ranking.

 

Hollywood

[BenchZowner]

( waiting for all the ES "owners" to vote for option #1 )...

 

[ I'm so getting confirmed ] { let's see what the "I care for the community, I don't give a sh*t about points, and "life is unfair" people will say/vote }

Edited June 6, 2010 by BenchZowner

[dread77]

( waiting for all the ES "owners" to vote for option #1 )...

 

[ I'm so getting confirmed ] { let's see what the "I care for the community, I don't give a sh*t about points, and "life is unfair" people will say/vote }

 

Well, don't waste your time Bill. If it was another "cheating thread" then it would be Breaking News all over the world within minutes...

 

"Big guys" feel safe with ES processors, there will be no more guys like Vivi, who will be talented enough to reach top 5 by using retail.

[Massman]

there will be no more guys like Vivi, who will be talented enough to reach top 5 by using retail.

 

Ryba did it not so long ago.

 

//edit: Stummerwinter as well

[AndreYang]

Ryba did it not so long ago.

 

//edit: Stummerwinter as well

 

 

 

I use retail W3540 and W3570 for top 1 for a while.

[euklidis]

Ryba did it not so long ago.

 

//edit: Stummerwinter as well

 

one out of hundreds and still 900+ points behind the ES owners...

[dread77]

I can't recall Ryba reaching top 5, but since you say so, there are no doubts...

 

Though, you are giving me two examples and it's like the exemptions which verify the rule... ES are better processors.

Who has access to ES processor? Very few (since it's illegal). So it looks like this whole thing is turning into a prive party... with sponcored cocktail drinks.

 

PS. Stummer should be No1 for quite sometime if there weren't ES processors.

[euklidis]

I use retail W3540 and W3570 for top 1 for a while.

 

any WR with W3570 retail? i don't think so... Make a WR with a retail w3570 or 980X to prove us wrong but i guess that is no possible...

[BenchZowner]

I'm not surprised at all on the votes for the time being.

I wouldn't be surprised to see how many people would quit benching once HWbot stops awarding points ( just be a WR ranking site like ripping.org ).

[Alriin]

This is a other Problem, Andre... ;-)

 

Ist not a Rule but our "Gentlemen Aggreement" that no one submit Results with Hardware before each Bencher can buy this Hardware.

No one can buy ES-CPUs legal!

[Massman]

Lol.

 

You make a statement, I quickly give two examples that prove the statement is wrong and you think it's proof that your statement is right. That's just wrong, mate. In addition, your assumption that Stummer would be on top if no ES were used is also incorrect: people who now use ES would then be using retail and there's no way to predict how that would've gone.

 

Or: none of your posts contain valid arguments. They're just based on flawed assumptions.

[BenchZowner]

Seeing how the rankings would be with the E.S. scores removed would be a great view to what's behind the curtains...

[Massman]

Seeing how the rankings would be with the E.S. scores removed would be a great view to what's behind the curtains...

 

You don't see how this is just incorrect?

 

If there were NO ES, people would've used RETAIL and submit scores with retail. Looking at rankings without ES = looking at the ranking without overclockers ...

[BenchZowner]

looking at the ranking without overclockers ...

 

So, you only consider the ES people as overclockers.

Since the rest are just "category fillers" for you, want to see how things can turn out once people start leaving ?

[chew*]

Some food for thought.

 

I have a 860 Es and a 980x ES. CBB -50 -90CB 860 ES. CBB -60 -100CB 980X.

Both suck.

 

I have a 920 retail. 4900 uncore through 32m CB -135

 

Now I have a retail 5870SOC, came in a retail box, is a retail revision and does 1500 ram through vantage......and don't give me the BS it needs to be binned on ln2.

 

Ram doesn't need ln2 binning. VDDR Ram can be binned just by looking at batch.

 

Point is there is no real solution and it can go either way. How hard is it to rebrand ES with retail batch info.......Lets look back at retail "recognized by cpu-z" AMD 955 BE HL ES chips.....

 

For the record the chip makers know where the best silicon is on a wafer.....they don't need to really get scientific about it once original testing is done.

 

Anyway my 2c i agree with gatman.

Edited June 6, 2010 by chew*

[knopflerbruce]

What he means is that the people who use ES chips would've used retails if there were no A0 samples here. Your model removes the boints achieved by engineering samples, but does not take into account the boints these guys would get if they binned retails instead.

[Gautam]

I'm with most of your guys complaints but what you're all missing is the fact that instating such a rule won't solve the problem that you guys want solved. It's not even a band-aid fix. You guys all want less manufacturer interference, and for it to be easier for the "average joe" to compete. Banning ESes won't accomplish any of that. What good did that "no ES" rule do in the Gigabyte uguru contest? If you take the GTX480 as an example, the issue isn't retail vs ES. Some people have access to special BIOSes that others don't. What good will banning ES cards do there? None.

 

Who will banning ESes really hurt? The same "average joes" you guys want to help. Forget about the A0 gulftowns and the C2 clarkdales for the time being. Look at all the ES results on hwbot. Who have these ESes? Were all of them seeded by manufacturers? No, most of them were purchased (illegally) by "regular" guys like yourselves, on ebay or otherwise. And about the A0's, there's plenty of results with them out there that are far from spectacular.

 

And here's the other thing. Everyone's out for sponsorships these days. When someone has an advantage that others don't, they will use it. If they don't have it, they will bitch about it. That's human nature, and it's being exemplified quite beautifully here. Quite ironic that the thread starter here is the same guy who has a sig full of thanks to his sponsors on xs. (I don't mean this as an attack on you Bill, but it's just too prevalent to not note)

 

But, it's much easier to act self-righteous chanting ideals about the "little guy" without thinking about what the hell you're posting. You always come out sounding right that way anyways.

 

If you guys are against overclocking being a playground for marketing teams then say so, but then don't turn around and be hypocrites and submit results using seeded hardware. Using the biggest whiners are the ones that already have some support but are just bitter that they don't have the royal treatment.

 

Personally, even years ago, when it started with mobo manufacturers seeding a board or two here and there, it made me uncomfortable, because I knew that eventually we'd end up in the very situation we're in now. Then I went along with the flow. Now I quit. I don't know what the answer is, but it sure as hell isn't as simple as banning ES cpus.

Edited June 6, 2010 by Gautam

[dread77]

LOL²

 

Just take a look at poll results, mate. It's just a sample yet but it looks like people is stating that ES processors are not necessary in Bot.

 

Regarding stummer, yes I am not able to predict how things would have turned out if there weren't ES around. It's just an assumption based on facts given by Hwbot database. You are not arguing with that, or are you?