Massman

Tin refers to a reason why this POLL is biased: there are more people who don't have an ES than people who do have an ES (just like there are more non-smokers than smokers). Because the group is a lot larger, it's likely that the outcome of the poll is affected by group size. Compare it to this: Group A = I like apples = 20 people Group B = I don't like apples = 1000 people Poll: should be remove apples from our shopping list? Since Group B is larger, more people will vote to remove apples. Actually, in Belgium we have a law to prevent large groups to win voting over small groups. This is a known phenomenon

I received info from GIGABYTE: all stages will now be opened 'till the end of June to give everyone max chance on submitting.

Just a heads up. From this point I'm ignoring everyone who has no intention of trying to find a solution to existing issues. Miahallen showed how to do it, BenchZowner doesn't. Euklidis: you're also close to getting ignored. Make your posts using decent arguments and word choice and you'll be heared. Use 'dude' and refuse to listen why solutions don't work and you get ignored.

Is Gendo pro?

I think this step is inevitable and much needed. First design plans have been made already (oldest document on hwbot is from Jan '10), but it has proven to be a gigantic problem as many people have to agree - the pros - the non-pros - the manufacturers - the hwbot coder Just to give you an example: it's a common wish to not have the sponsored guys affect the normal guys in the rankings. Now, if the pros are moved to a seperate category, the HWBOINTS algorithm is no longer applicable in the PRO league (as it's design for 1000+ submissions). In addition, moving to the pro category will also mean that you lose all the points you have in the normal category, which will heavily affect your team's total. Another grave problem is how to define pro (is getting one free motherboard equal to being pro?) and how to enforce this (how can we know you have a free board?).

First statement is wrong. It's been proven over and over again that disallowing ES in competitions doesn't increase the amount of participants. Sounds right in theory, but ain't true. Most used equipment != most owned equipment. It's very likely that the i7 920 has been used the most, but that doesn't mean a lot of overclockers have this CPU at their home.

Ram != Imc

I can check, but cannot guarantee

If I not mistaken, the IMC in the S939 CPUS is running always 1:1 with the CPU frequency, which means that increasing the CPU frequency also increases the IMC frequency.

Have you looked at the GTX 480 rankings?

But would that make HWBOT so much more fun? Imagine you benching this golden CPU and then realize that you need video + photo proof to show people you're not using an illegal CPU? With the risk that people will say you manipulated the video in some way? In theory it's a solution' date=' but in practice it's just not an option, I think. Why do you post things like this? You know as well as I do that the ES flag is a hardware issue that cannot be solved with better software. The example of AMD is perfect: no software can detect it's an engineering sample IF the CPU is branded as retail. The engineering sample as we know it is just 'a piece of silicon with the brand ES'. Even if the CPU itself is flagged as ES, mainboard manufacturers can adjust the microcode in the bios so that the ES flag will not be 1. Or: ES samples will appear as normal retail.

... you ... can ... make ... ES ... look ... like ... retail ... Does everyone understand that the our entire knowledge of the ES sample is based on the "(ES)" indication in the CPU-Z software application? That's the ONLY clue we have when it comes to detecting ES in screenshots ... even FM links don't say ES or not. Okay, if you understand this, then ... Do you guys remember that AMD has made HIGH-LEAKAGE ES samples look like retail in CPU-Z? Okay, if you remember this, then ... 1) We can only detect "ES" with CPU-Z 2) You can make CPU-Z see "non-retail" as "retail" => Remove ES = ???

Seriously, is no one reading my posts? I have always said that SOMETHING MUST BE DONE and that JUST REMOVING ES SCORES IS NOT AN OPTION. The latter doesn't mean that there's no option, it just means that removing the ES scores TOMORROW is not the solution everyone wants here. This is NOT about ES samples, this is about MANUFACTURER INTERFERENCE. Ok, I used caps and bold to make it more clear. Hope it works ...

Did you guys notice that I just never said nothing has to be done? Or did you just filter that out. The entire discussion here is about removing or not removing the ES scores. It's quite clear that most of the community likes to see the crazy results and therefore should not be removed from HWBOT. On the other hand, there's also a vast majority that acknowledges the fact that there's an issue with the rankings at the moment and that changes are necessary to make it more pleasant. If you have the time, read this reply: http://hwbot.org/forum/showpost.php?p=58963&postcount=267. Also read Gautam's reply in this thread.

Oh wait ... i though that your proposal was "ban all es - there is no other solution" You should really be more clear about the message you're sending.

Your proposed solution of banning all ES is not supported by the community. Oh, wait ... we need more votes, right?

It's currently 73 against 29 in favor of allowing ES on HWBOT ...

No worries. This is quite typical: now we are in the phase where we're blurting out random stuff to continue a discussion without it being about the real topic anymore.

Right there. That's why I don't have to listen to any of your arguments

I won't close this one; it contains info as well.

One step forward, then twenty steps backwards. It's been said a million times, and not just by me, removing ES from HWBOT is just a very short highly ineffective solution. There's no point in faking to provide a solution when it's no solution at all. As I've said in the other thread. YES, we are looking into this. YES, it's possible. NO it's not as simple as just splitting up.

Remounting now

... I just finished ...

How many people who vote "no points" would quickly GAIN points? It's biased from both sides

Hahaha ... sure; no one is asking HWBOT ... I already said it in the other thread, man, I never ever refuse to listen to suggestions or ideas. All you need to do is gather a set of valid arguments and accept that YOUR vision might not be the correct one. For me, discussions end when people are only out to make noise, use simplistic and populistic arguments to win people over, use arguments that are flawed from top to bottom, do not accept that the suggested solution will bring similar problems in the future and are this only a very short-term solution. It's easy to see through the sherade some people put up here; just have a look at arguments against the easy solution ...