question regarding water chillers

[Guest TheMadDutchDude]

I think that is well put. Chillers should remain as water cooling because even though you're making the water colder than say a radiator in a normal loop would, and others clearly pointed out, what's to stop you from dunking a radiator in a bucket of ice? That doesn't then become extreme cooling, it's still classed as water cooling.

 

I've taken water from outside when it was just above freezing and used my hosepipe to cool my CPU to get some really impressive clocks for what was a stupid idea. It was still cooled by water, nothing else.

[Zka17]

You cannot be serious...

 

Obviously wasn't… at least not more than the original idea about compressors…

[Mr.Scott]

I think that is well put. Chillers should remain as water cooling because even though you're making the water colder than say a radiator in a normal loop would, and others clearly pointed out, what's to stop you from dunking a radiator in a bucket of ice? That doesn't then become extreme cooling, it's still classed as water cooling.

 

I've taken water from outside when it was just above freezing and used my hosepipe to cool my CPU to get some really impressive clocks for what was a stupid idea. It was still cooled by water, nothing else.

 

Yes. Reinforces my point. :celebration:

[Zka17]

As I said before, I agree too!

Now who should we invite to this thread, who should we talk to? Who can make this change?

[ObscureParadox]

What have I done, I've created a monster D:

[Zka17]

What have I done, I've created a monster D:

 

He-he, now you will need to get a chiller...

[IanCutress]

This topic has been discussed AT LENGTH before on the forum (I'm sure even I've told you Lewis!).

 

Using a water chiller with WATER: OK for Enthusiast League

Using a water chiller with a blend: Not OK, move on up.

 

It's also the only way regular enthusiast users can compete with sub-zero climates of mountain benchers.

 

I have a Hailea chiller, just need to get the rest of the loop. These chillers are built to have 3C to 20C selectable - the only way to go lower is by modding the thing.

[Zka17]

This topic has been discussed AT LENGTH before on the forum (I'm sure even I've told you Lewis!).

 

I've had that sensation too... yet it is a recurring question... - that's why it would be nice to have an official statement from the HWBOT staff...

[poparamiro]

There you go: enthusiast league with 1100+mhz HD4850 on water

 

http://hwbot.org/submission/2522209_flashg_3dmark_vantage___performance_radeon_hd_4850_gddr3_15051_marks

[Zka17]

There you go: enthusiast league with 1100+mhz HD4850 on water

 

Well, if he did not go below 0C... but those cases are definitely for the mods to ask for further proof - like the video you were mentioning...

 

Have you tried your modded HD4850 with the rad dropped in a bucket of icy water? That would be still above 0C...

[poparamiro]

Not one HD4850 on this earth will do 1100+ mhz on water, even if it is at -10 oC.

 

They hardly hit 1000 -1020mhz, best of them.

 

I mostly use water at 1-3c.

Edited April 1, 2014 by poparamiro

[Aleslammer]

The compressor concept, would that include commercial walk-in freezers, would that also apply to an air compressor for use with a Vortex spot cooler?

 

Water ice can be as cold as the device making it can produce or chilled with dry ice; pure water can stay in a fluid state well below freezing (drew my attention when I saw it on PBS) but would be next to impossible to do in normal loop but doable if the motivation existed.

 

Do we need another league for the in between cooling solutions. How about TEC has limited use with modern hardware but drop back a few generations and it becomes very practical. Personally have no problem with fluid/air chillers that produce temps in line with the normally occupied latitudes but how many would start changing coolants maybe a cascade chiller or a dice acetone slush box (the trust question) and at what point do we lose the concept of the EL, maybe a question for the league itself.

[IanCutress]

You might be confusing the science here.

 

Here is the phase diagram of pure water:

 

 

In order to get below 0C with pure, regular liquid water, you would need atmospheric pressure around 100 MPa (or 1000 atmospheres).

 

Supercooling is a process that allows liquid water to be below zero, but any presence of turbulence (i.e. a pump or a heat source) or nucleation site (water cooling tubes) will cause the liquid water to form water ice.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercooling

 

Using a commercial walk-in fridge to increase the localised air pressure will have minimal effect. The act of opening the door creates the slush - movement creating nucleation sites.

 

Of course when you start using blends (water/ethanol, antifreeze), then the freezing point can be lower than 0C due to the prevalence of hydrogen bonding in the mixture. Add in a multi-alcohol chained compound into water and away you go. But as we have mentioned, introducing a blend means you should be moving on up. Is there a way to check if someone has used a blend? No, but therein lies a small amount of trust within the community (just like everyone trusts you won't murder someone in the street).

Edited April 2, 2014 by borandi

[Aleslammer]

The example that I saw on TV was in relation to an aircraft that had gone missing and possible causes, one of which was flying into thunderheads with possible ice forming from liquid water on the air speed indicators causing a failure of the auto compensators. The example showed a small metal rod as the contaminant being inserted in a glass beaker causing spontaneous freezing of the water, I don’t remember seeing any protective gear other than a gloves for the rod and beaker but I wasn’t paying that much attention. No argument with presented fact but assuming the plane was around 11500 meters one would think there would be less than one atmosphere but really don’t know the conditions present in a thunderhead, just trying to put the two together.

 

Nova #3807H

Crash of Flight 447

 

Copied this out of the transcrpt

 

JOHN WILLIAMS: One of the things that we're interested in is what were the conditions at 35,000 feet? What kind of ice or liquid was there at that altitude?

 

NARRATOR: John Williams turns again to the new NASA satellite images.

 

JOHN WILLIAMS: One of the first things we want to do is try to figure out what the temperatures were at that level.

 

NARRATOR: He creates a cross-section, showing the temperature at different altitudes.

 

JOHN WILLIAMS: What it shows, starting at the surface and going up to the top of the atmosphere—they were flying at this level here, and you can see that the temperatures were about 40-below at the time and location of the accident.

 

NARRATOR: Minus 40 may seem extremely cold, but, in fact, it's much warmer than is usual at 35,000 feet.

 

These unusual temperature readings suggest than an unusual phenomenon may have occurred.

 

JOHN WILLIAMS: What we've found out from this analysis is that it's possible that there was supercooled liquid water at the altitude of the aircraft.

 

NARRATOR: Supercooled water is a weird quirk of physics where extremely pure water remains liquid at temperatures well below freezing.

 

In 32 years experience, Tony Cable has never actually seen this phenomenon up close.

 

The purified water in these bottles is well below its normal freezing point, but it's still liquid. Ice crystals can only grow around tiny particles like impurities or bubbles. When Cable inserts a metal tube...

 

TONY CABLE: Hey!

 

NARRATOR: ...instant ice.

 

TONY CABLE: That is incredible.

 

JOHN WILLIAMS: The fact that air is really clean over the oceans suggests that if there is supercooled liquid water in the atmosphere, and an aircraft flies through that, those little droplets are ready to freeze as soon as they hit a surface.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Aleslammer
Corrected 747, changed to 447

[davidpotter]

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Edited May 23, 2016 by davidpotter

[suzuki]

Is there an official answer on this thread ?

There are more than 5 users in enthusiast league (talking about above 500 points) which use waterchiller.

Can a admin say what is allowed and what is not ?