Official Country Cup 2017 thread

[yosarianilives]

Hi, as country cup starts tomorrow I'd like to make sure that I know what each stage is and what is allowed before I buy any new hw.

For stage 1 it 8 different intel cpu subfamilies. Does this mean i9, i7, i5, etc or is this generations like kabylake, skylake, haswell, ivy bridge, etc.?

 

Then for stage 4 it needs 4 seperate gcn1 model gpus. So for example r9 280x, r9 280, 7970, and 7950 is good and we don't need seperate actual chips (tahiti xt, tahiti pro, tahiti le)? Also going along with that question is HD 8000 series allowed and are firepros allowed? Neither are server hw, and technically did retail although you could not buy hd 8000 outside of a prebuilt pc and firepro is enterprise workstation class even if it's not server hw.

 

For stage 5 I assume vega is allowed. (not sure why it shouldn't be, just thought I'd make sure)

 

The only other thing is on each of the actual stage pages they don't have any details about the stage except to list the end date, which is in December. However on the rules page everything is listed as ending in November. As well as the overview page still claiming the last stage is multi-gpu when it is not. (Copy paste FTW!)

 

Kinda a long post with lots of questions, but I figured may as well get all this clarified early, especially if the end dates in the rules are the correct ones.

[websmile]

Stage1: Orientate at database, kbl for example has different subfamilies like i7, i5 and so on, also mobile. Question answers itself by this. Same for all gens. Coffeelake is not allowed because we have low availability at several regions and prices are ridiculous where you can buy them.

Stage 4:Model means model, this is determined by the card´s vendor classification, chip doesnt matter, you can find this at database as well. We wanted to merge some models but seems this will not happen before the cup. Please use aida to show the card apart from GPUZ to avoid irritations when cards are not fullyrecognized by GPUZ. No firepro cards.

Stage5:Vega is widely available, I see no problem with this.

About the details and end date please contact massman, I did several times and nothing changed, maybe he listens to you...

Edited October 31, 2017 by websmile

[yosarianilives]

Stage1: Orientate at database, kbl for example has different subfamilies like i7, i5 and so on, also mobile. Question answers itself by this. Same for all gens.

 

Wait, so are you saying that for the purpose of stage 1 a kabylake i7 counts as a different subfamily as a skylake i7? Or do you mean that you need a score from any i7, any i5, any i3, etc. ?

[websmile]

If you look at the hwbot database or at Intel data you will see that Kabylake and skylake are to different cpu families, so each of the subfamilies like i7 skylake or i7 kabylake are unique subfamilies. Seems to be quite logical.

On stage 3 we will have to rule out Coffeelake as well - I hope we get an update on the rules for this

[yosarianilives]

Okay, thanks! That makes it crystal clear. Should be really fun this way.

[Frito11]

probably want to put a proper example in the stage info like

 

example

1x of each

i7 kaby lake

i5 kaby lake

i3 kaby lake

i9 skylake

i7 skylake

i5 skylake

i3 skylake

 

etc.

 

just so its clear.

[Dead Things]

For stage 2, what is the rule for unlocking cores? Phenom X2 550 BE, for example. Is it still a dual-core CPU with cores unlocked?

 

Also, is "Please attach a picture of your overclocking rig in use" considered a polite suggestion again?

 

Sounds similar to "Please provide a screenshot with official background, CPUZ CPU, mainboard, memory and SPD tab and GPUZ for 3D stages" - which is obviously not a polite suggestion.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Dead Things

[zeropluszero]

Coffee lake rule is crap. They're totally retail and launched. But whatever.

Clarify everything that is not allowed please.

 

and I assume 7740K is considered different to 7700K? or is this not right since they're "kaby lake i7"

Edited October 31, 2017 by zeropluszero

[macsbeach98]

For stage 2, what is the rule for unlocking cores? Phenom X2 550 BE, for example. Is it still a dual-core CPU with cores unlocked?

 

Also, is "Please attach a picture of your overclocking rig in use" considered a polite suggestion again?

 

Sounds similar to "Please provide a screenshot with official background, CPUZ CPU, mainboard, memory and SPD tab and GPUZ for 3D stages" - which is obviously not a polite suggestion.

 

I doubt weather unlocking will be allowed it says. 1,2,4,6,8 cores.

[websmile]

No core unlocking, makes no sense anyway because you are only allowed to use 1,2,4,6 and 8 core cpu because we knew people will be more interested in loopholes than solid benching, at least some of them.

The picture rule is nonsense in a non cooling or vendor limited comp, I will talk to Pieter again how to enforce this if we do. I somehow think people will not be happy if I remove scores bc I see no spinning fan at cpu cooler or LN2 mist.

On coffeelake, availability is that good that cheapest 8700k boxed cpu listed in stock at german price portals is 500-550 Euros and in some countries not even distributors have date when they get it. This is a worldwide competition so availability is a factor we cannot neglect

Edit: for stage one 7740K is KBL, means same cpu family - weird, but I have to go with the database

Overclocking, overclocking, and much more! Like overclocking.)

Edited October 31, 2017 by websmile

[yosarianilives]

and I assume 7740K is considered different to 7700K? or is this not right since they're "kaby lake i7"

 

They should be the same, look at how they're classified on hwbot. Both kabylake i7.

[yosarianilives]

Okay, so now that the comp is live the stage rules are on each stage page. However on for stage 1 is only says an intel cpu is required with no mention of cpu subfamiles. Also stage 5 has a requirement of: A videocard manufactured by 1. I'm not sure what it's 1 of, but might want to check on that. Also overview still implies there's a final stage after all 6 of these stages that involves multi-gpu (Copy Pasta FTW again!) Could you take a look at these @Massman ?

[Strunkenbold]

and I assume 7740K is considered different to 7700K? or is this not right since they're "kaby lake i7"

 

I didnt create an extra subfamily like Core i7 (Kabylake-X) because there is, beside the package and bin, no real difference to a 7700K Kabylake. Since it is just another variant of the Kabylake core, we arent doing anything wrong here, IMO.

[zeropluszero]

I mean, I think it should be considered something seperate but no point in arguing.

[Matt26LFC]

There's a 4770K sub in 32M for Country Cup, some official clarification on what can and can't be subbed please

[websmile]

There's a 4770K sub in 32M for Country Cup, some official clarification on what can and can't be subbed please

 

There is no restriction on which cpu can be used (apart from cfl), only that just one processor per subfamily counts to the ranks. You can even bench a wolfdale if you want. Maybe you mixed this up with stage 3?

[suzuki]

Basically the folowing for stage 1:

7700k /6700k//4790k/4770k/3770k ?

hedt also (5820k,6900x etc ?)

5 subs per country ?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Splave]

kaby contains kabyx and sky contains skyx interesting indeed

 

Coffee i3 should be same as kaby 7600k then following this logic since its exactly the same die.

Edited November 2, 2017 by Splave

[yosarianilives]

Really not sure the confusion here? Everything intel calls a kabylake i7 is a kabylake i7, everything they call a skylake i7 is a skylake i7 seems to make sense to me. If you want to try to beat a 4770k with a 5960x that's on your IMHO should be the same for x299 vs z170.

[Splave]

^not confused just seems silly. do you think a 4770k is at all like a 5960x?

[zeropluszero]

Are we able to get clarification on 3dmark11 stage for CC?

is it?

 

1. AMD CPU & AMD GPU

2. Any CPU & AMD GPU

3. AMD CPU & Any GPU??

Edited November 3, 2017 by zeropluszero

[websmile]

Option one, full AMD - three different GPUs needed - we will fix submission and clarify this start of next week

[Strunkenbold]

kaby contains kabyx and sky contains skyx interesting indeed

 

Coffee i3 should be same as kaby 7600k then following this logic since its exactly the same die.

 

Okay, some more explanation needed here...

 

We define a subfamily by the name and the micro-architecture used. The Family is the micro-architecture. e.g. Skylake = mirco-architecture, Core i7 (Skylake) = subfamily

There are other approaches like just using Core i7 as family but I think that doesnt matter in this case. We decided to go that way and in my opinion it was the best option for hwbot.

 

So why havent received Kaby X and Skylake X not their own subfamily or mirco-architecture?

For the microarchitecure its quite simple, those CPUs are simply not based on a new architecture, or at least Intel decided so.

For the subfamily, there is besides the X in the name, no difference to the stock Core i7s . So its a Core i7 in both cases. In case of the Core i9s, a new subfamily was created. I also had created another subfamily if Intel said, lets name those Core i6 ore Core i8.

 

The reason why you are all confused is that CPU-Z is showing the -X suffix in the core name but if CPU-Z would be consistent it would show other suffixes too. For Kaby we have:

Kaby Lake Y

Kaby Lake U

Kaby Lake R

Kaby Lake H

Kaby Lake S

Kaby Lake G

Kaby Lake X

Kaby Lake DT

 

All of those core variants are part of the Kaby Lake family but most of the cores have their own subfamilies, like Core i7 mobile for Kaby Lake H. So we have here one of the cases where two core variants share the same subfamily. These might be rare cases but actually it happens quite often in the db, you just dont see this because I didnt created those exact core names like you see above. I actually thinking about doing this, now that I see it causes confusion.

 

Now you argue that Coffeelake Core i3s are actually Kabylakes. This might be very true but...Welcome to the world of rebranding. Intels marketing team decided that those are Coffeelakes. As Im not a technical expert, I cant say if there are really no technical differences. So hwbot has to assume that there is indeed a difference. Similar things happen for GPUs all the time. We know that there is probably no difference, vendors are releasing new stuff all the time, which is actually old hardware with new name and we do nothing about that. Because if it gets properly detected, we have no problems with it. Otherwise things would get very complicated and thus creating unnecessary work for the moderation team.

[yosarianilives]

Welcome to the world of rebranding. Intels marketing team decided that those are Coffeelakes. As Im not a technical expert, I cant say if there are really no technical differences. So hwbot has to assume that there is indeed a difference. Similar things happen for GPUs all the time. We know that there is probably no difference, vendors are releasing new stuff all the time, which is actually old hardware with new name and we do nothing about that. Because if it gets properly detected, we have no problems with it. Otherwise things would get very complicated and thus creating unnecessary work for the moderation team.

 

Exactly, I don't see anyone complaining that it's gonna end up being 2 gpu cores to make up 5 subs for gpupi.

[yosarianilives]

Option one, full AMD - three different GPUs needed - we will fix submission and clarify this start of next week

 

Does this also mean 3 different AMD cpus? Or would it be okay to do all 3 subs with a 1950x for example so long as gpus are different?