Rev3 Up and Running - Complaints, Ideas, Ramblings, Comments ... but no bugs

[Advanced]

Yo cannot assume that the rest is satisfied just because they are not replying to this thread.

[Massman]

It is no problem that popular hardware gets more points.

But non-popular hardware does not need to get less points. I would not mind if they get same points as in Rev2.

 

It's quite difficult to explain in english, but the one affects the other: the more points you give to popular hardware, the less points you're awarding to non-popular hardware. Once you've defined "popular", you've also defined "not popular".

 

I think the biggest problem here is the drop in points. This is a psychological effect we could've worked around by multiplying all points by 10. Everyone would have a massive boost in points ... but the rankings would not change, not your personal, nor your team ranking.

[Alriin]

41 people replied in this thread. incl MM, RB, and others who reported bugs.

20.000 people using HWbot.

=0.2%

 

everyone.

 

41 People are online, and 41 People hate Rev3. I think thats 100%.

[Leeghoofd]

Is there a way to get another font or sortlike to distinguish the differents benchmarks when looking eg in the hall of fame ?

[Massman]

0

 

why is this relevant

 

that's just being ignorant

 

No. You're making assumptions about future submissions not knowing the Factual effect.

 

And if you are going to start calling names, please log off and go celebrate new year.

[Massman]

Yo cannot assume that the rest is satisfied just because they are not replying to this thread.

 

Yes. People who don't like it are more likely to respond.

[Advanced]

I think the biggest problem here is the drop in points.

Yep. I almost lost 2/3 of my points and I simply do not understand why this had to be done.

I had many scores in the middlefield like #15 and now I do not get points for my effort anymore.

[knopflerbruce]

It is no problem that popular hardware gets more points.

But non-popular hardware does not need to get less points. I would not mind if they get same points as in Rev2.

 

14 boints for running alot of stuff at stock was too much. And I know what I'm talking about, as I did get alot of cups by benching VERY unpopular stuff. IMO 1.5 for being first when there is no competition is far from being too little... Plus, there was nearly no difference between 1st and 3rd when you had few results in rev. 2. In all competitions where you're given points for your results, you always get much more for being 1st than for the others, even if you compete with 100 others. I can't imagine anyone been given 75% of the winner's boints when they ended up being 3rd out of 4 participants, or something like that.

 

Edit: everyone had a chance to see the test server, and to make suggestions for this revision. Those who hate this revision and never posted their thoughts when the test server was online etc should remember that until rev. 4, and not make the same mistake again

Edited December 31, 2009 by knopflerbruce

[Chiller]

most people don't complaine, or they are on other side of world and still a sleep.

 

this is only the first few hours, there will be more to come that are going to complain.

 

i lost the trust in Hwbot now and my opinion is that Hwbot is NOT anymore the standaard of the world for ranking.

 

a WR with a cpu that only 5 people have gets less points then a 920 where 20.000 people have.

 

this can't be right

[SoF]

Only thing he has to do is test 1 5870 in 6 benchmarks and he'll be incredibly close to KP again.

 

see....you write it but you just think different than me

Looks like you missed MY main focus of overclocking - highest possible scores. You say it: Boris needs to bench weaker hardware now...All you made with rev3 is to make the overclocking league a single-gpu bound league...didn't had a closer look into CPUs yet, don't want to...

And you do not credit thoose guys with the overall best scores anymore...no CF, no SLI will ever be able to bring you on top anymore...I hoped it will be balanced, that single and multi solutions will have a fixed basis for their records (e.g. 100 Points) so that thoose with less money take single gpu and others fight in multi gpu - but all globals are balanced in points. it's just such a tiny change to the current situation but it would make such a BIG difference.

I got all the "we want more people to be competitive" and I agree with you in many points...just like I said, my main focus was always a bit different, a bit more expensive, a bit more exclusive, just as many points as possible.

 

Apart from that thanks for a great time with hwbot v2 - over the years it was always motivating and fascinating. Gave me many hours of fun and pleasure. Keep working on hwbot it can just get better :ws:

[Massman]

Yep. I almost lost 2/3 of my points and I simply do not understand why this had to be done.

I had many scores in the middlefield like #15 and now I do not get points for my effort anymore.

 

How much places did you fall in the ranking?

[knopflerbruce]

As long as people haven't been benching "rev 3 style" yet, I don't think it's a good thing to start complaining to soon. It's a different approach, and naturally the ranks may be a bit weird in the beginning, until people start benching in January;)

 

Edit: 1000 posts before 2010:D

[Alriin]

I think a lot of Modifications are good, but its demotivate when Rank 5 become the same Points as Rank 12. This is the great mistake!

[knopflerbruce]

I think a lot of Modifications are good, but its demotivate when Rank 5 become the same Points as Rank 12. This is the great mistake!

 

If you look at the same rank, that's not true. The best 50% get HW boints, so 7th and 12th should get the same 0.1 boints, but 5th will give a bit more.

[Advanced]

How much places did you fall in the ranking?

700 ranks...

[Massman]

see....you write it but you just think different than me

Looks like you missed MY main focus of overclocking - highest possible scores. You say it: Boris needs to bench weaker hardware now...All you made with rev3 is to make the overclocking league a single-gpu bound league...didn't had a closer look into CPUs yet, don't want to...

 

Yes, and in contrary to you, we have had tons of people complain that the 3D rankings are not 3D anymore and that we need more GPU-bound benchmarks ...

 

I can understand that if you have a great CPU, you want all the benchmarks to be CPU-bound. Or, if you have a great GPU, you want all benchmarks to be GPU-bound. Trying to make something that goes in the middle will upset either types of persons for sure.

 

And you do not credit thoose guys with the overall best scores anymore...no CF, no SLI will ever be able to bring you on top anymore...I hoped it will be balanced, that single and multi solutions will have a fixed basis for their records (e.g. 100 Points) so that thoose with less money take single gpu and others fight in multi gpu - but all globals are balanced in points. it's just such a tiny change to the current situation but it would make such a BIG difference. .

 

You're right, it's not about the highest score per definition anymore, because we have learned that when it's only about the highest score, more people complain about the fact that huge financial input equals high and easy points. And that is a very valid complaint: why should money be the main factor in being able to compete?

 

Furhtermore, recent events have shown that when it's just about the highest scores software coding becomes more important than the performance of hardware. I mean, if you want to see 1,000,000 in AM3, it's possible with the right tools ... the score is higher, but I'm not particularly more happy to see this higher score.

[speddy411]

As long as people haven't been benching "rev 3 style" yet, I don't think it's a good thing to start complaining to soon. It's a different approach, and naturally the ranks may be a bit weird in the beginning, until people start benching in January;)

 

Edit: 1000 posts before 2010:D

 

Why should I ?

 

Some weeks ago I bought many Socket 462 CPU and 2 Abit NF7-S.

 

But why the Hell should I bench it ?

 

Most of the CPUs i bought just award me with 2 Points when im Number 1 and if I take Place 2 I just get 0.1 Points....There is no Motivation for me to Vmod the Board and look for the best config if the Change to get Points is 50/50.

[Massman]

700 ranks...

 

You're now 1800th of 21000th without having to go very far with any hardware. Sounds reasonable?

[Massman]

Why should I ?

 

Some weeks ago I bought many Socket 462 CPU and 2 Abit NF7-S.

 

But why the Hell should I bench it ?

 

Most of the CPUs i bought just award me with 2 Points when im Number 1 and if i take Place 2 i just get 0.1 Points....There is no Motivation for me to Vmod the Board and look for the best config if the Change to get Points is 50/50.

 

I did too

[TiN]

First of all, I like new rev3. Yes, I lost points, and my team lost points quite noticeaby. But I like new ideas, and as my teammate said - Idea of competition on bot is more close to the idea of overclocking with new rev.

 

And now Bug report

 

Wrecked positioning for old profile page (tested with IE7,Opera10). Maybe better drop old profile view? New design was a while ago already, and people get used. Also all important functional stuff exist in new tabs already.

 

Problem with cyrillic letters. Was exist in rev2 too. E.G. submit with russian-named screenshot name get "Crap error" , same with cyrillic letters in description. Not a big deal, but still, sometimes boring.

 

Need updated rules article

 

--------------/end of bugreport

 

Idea: as was stated earlier maybe worth add bit more linearity for first TOP10 of hardware stuff. Or better reward top 10% of hardware category submission. Currenty there is no much sense benching even popular graphics without anything except LN2 and top fast CPU's.

 

Or maybe lower popularity level to less users. There are not much popular (in term of hwbot ranks) hardware with current level.

 

+ I would add

 

Global ranking for 1 GPU

Global ranking for 2 GPU

Global ranking for 3 GPU

Global ranking for 4 GPU

 

as was stated by BenchBros. It's nice to have ranks for x GPU to compare stuff

 

and maybe add chilled cooling type. I'd consider all sub-zero chilled stuff here, like aircooling openair stand in winter, liquid chiller with ice from fridge, liquid chilled with glycol/alcohol frozen by AC unit and so on.

----

And as for complaint. People argue to death,but why nobody notice, that benching popular hardware (or unpopular, no matter) CANT HELP to be on overclocking league TOP (or to be at least 50th) AT ALL. Coz 300hwboint limit. Even if somebody benched E6600 with 8800GTX and get 1000000 points for it, this is nothing to overclocking league, where people do WR's and sleep with LN2 dewar!

 

And question for admins. On testserver we had more points (>20k for TOP3 teams afaik), and people had more too, than last days testserver and mainserver now. Change to algorithm. I missed this someway, please describe.

Edited December 31, 2009 by TiN

[thebanik]

How much places did you fall in the ranking?

 

I lost more than 100 ranks, got more hardware points than rev2 in rev3 but lost almost all of my 180 global points because I used to bench the best single CARD, i.e 3870x2, 4870x2, GTX295, 2 x 5870.

 

Now all I did was post scores from a card which is not attractive by any margin, 5870, from last week and I am back to where I was but as I said earlier is this the way forward??? I guess SOF is saying the same thing

Edited December 31, 2009 by thebanik

[romdominance]

Maybe by using an example, I will get my point thru more effectively.

These are actual team members results....talking globally now.

 

Teammate A at NBOC has a Classified with 3x 5870's, a W3570 cpu under SS and has benched for many hours to get the best possible results

= 420bts and 19th in the US /rev2

 

Teammate B at NBOC has a Vanilla X58 with 1x gtx285, a 920 cpu under a chiller and has benched for 1/4 of the hours of mate A to get best possible results

=160bts and 55th in the US /rev2

 

Now overnight

 

Teammate A= 294bts and 37th in US rev/3

Teammate B= 303bts and 35th in US rev/3

 

This is due mainly to the fact that the hardware used by TM A is multi-GPU (big no no in rev3) and the hardware used by TM B is the most popular.

 

How does this reward the best scores? How does this add incentive to our teammates to keep benching against and with eachother?

 

Oh and the test server was unavailable to most of us until 2 days ago.

[Massman]

from a card which is not attractive by any margin, 5870, from last week and I am back to where I was but as I said earlier is this the way forward

 

Less attractive for what?

 

- Gaming?

- Performance?

- Overclocking?

- Competition?

- Economical?

[Alriin]

If you look at the same rank, that's not true. The best 50% get HW boints, so 7th and 12th should get the same 0.1 boints, but 5th will give a bit more.

 

thats what i say: a lot of People become 0,1 Points. Whats the Motivation for Rookies or Occasional-Bencher to make a better Score when the most Scores brings the same Points? In the past i work hours and hours to bring a Score up from Rank 12 to 11, and then i look to hit Rank 10. A good many times i have luck (and i little bit skill) to jump with this method from a average Rank into the Top 5.

 

I have enough Hardware and the Equipment to bench all my Stuff with Extreme-Cooling, but the most People on HWbot bench with Air Cooling. And the most People - 10000 of Average Benchers - make HWbot to the greatest Overclocking-Platform. With Rev3 you kick this 10000 People in the Ass. Sorry. :-(

[Massman]

How does this add incentive to our teammates to keep benching against and with eachother?

 

There's less financial input required to make an actual head-to-head bench. From what I can see, teammate A won because he purchased more hardware.