Massman Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 Oh, just a question. Would I be allowed to submit my 1300MHz GTX480 to this retail-oc-website? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenchZowner Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 Reality is a bit different: whoever is capable of binning A0 to the extreme, is also capable of binning B1 to the extreme. Whoever is capable of binning 100 video cards ... and so on. Â Are you sure that's in line with the reality ? Reality is, well.. Andre can buy lots of retails and bin. True and nobody has a problem with that, nobody ever said it was an issue ( it's a common secret that some people RMA their CPUs a few times to get a better chip because they're greedy or just can't afford buying a couple of 999$ CPUs ). Â The real deal breaker would be the "access to Intel or Asus/Gigabyte/eVGA" E.S. cabinet/gatherings, bench the CPUs, and get the best chip with you as you leave, thank you sir. Â With retail only allowed, everybody will have a chance to get the best chip ( for the time being of course, there's no best forever ), something that cannot be done with the E.S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 So, if I'm reading between the lines correctly, it's not so much about the ES mark on the CPU but rather the fact that the good CPUs are in the hands of manufacturers and are spread to overclockers. Or: the fact that some people from the community are (pre-)selected to use these very good samples to break some world records. Â Would this be ok then: a manufacturer invites a few overclockers for an overclocking gathering. At this gathering, each are handed a tray of 200 retail 980X and they have a week to bench and at the end they can take the best 980X home as present for the work. Retail is of course not bought-in-the-shop retail, but with a retail stepping on top of the IHS. Or allow those people to bin through 100 GTX 480s and each take a 1350MHz card home? Â To me, it still seems to be an attempt to cling on to the illusion that everyone is much more fair when there are no retail. The whole notion of an increased chance on having the best chip is contradiction the attempt to make it more fair as the one with the most luck would be having the best scores. And luck isn't a particularly fair concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenchZowner Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 Looks like you're not reading the lines. Things will never be absolutely fair, since luck can always be a factor and that alone makes it unfair. Being retail only, the X guy has a chance of getting lucky and picking up a "crazy chip" or the Y guy buying and selling 2-3 980X's getting a good chip at his 3rd take. Â The "hooked up" guys will always get to bin CPUs, but with retail only the difference between the two will be smaller, and it won't be impossible for a non-hooked up guy to get a great CPU, possibly even better than a binned chip of the A guy. Â It's not that hard to understand this post hopefully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K404 Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 Ummm... heading off-topic *slightly* what do people think about a pro league for the scores/ users who are heavily supplied/ funded by manufacturers? Â Its much harder for some guy to compete out of his own pocket when they have to decide which component they can afford with this months wages and go up against a guy who was sent everything by a sponsor. Â We all know that when hardware is on-tap and free... the way we clock it is different. It's easy to be extreme but theres no finanical loss for mistakes or over-ambition. Â I won't cry myself to sleep if things aren't split off, but it would be nice to see the mere mortals have a better shot at higher rankings. Â I wish I could suggest: Â CPU given by company- 2D benches go in pro league. Â GPU given by company: 3D benches go in pro-league... Â but I know its near-impossible to enforce. "Yea, I was sent two, but this one is mine" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crew Antinomy Posted June 2, 2010 Crew Share Posted June 2, 2010 Nice one, K404. There's one more issue - there are members and even teams that get hardware from a shop where one of the members works or his friend does. They bench it and give back. Yes, it's not the case when it's free and you can burn it with no worry, but a team that can take ten GTX480 and ten 5870 and bench them on a top test bed can perform definetely better than the ones that buy stuff from their pocket. Â And it's unreal to trace this out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crustytheclown Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 Damn, I tried to have date with Miss Finland, but she decided to go with NHL hockey player who earns few millions in a year by playing with black rubber thing. Damn..life is so unfair  Damn she was my backup plan...  Relax you guys... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crio Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 I agree with K404 and bill partially. Pieter we all bench cause it makes us feel good and gives us a huge excitement BUT when you need 3000$ to do some good scores and you see your hardware is too far behind some crazy A0 samples then yes,you get frustrated.With the E8600 and later with the bloomfield the differencies wheren't that huge.Now how do we expcect from a person to spend that amount of money when there is nothing to look for besides some fun?Like it or not a really good score is what we all want.If it was just for the fun of benching we would be playing with a chip that costs 50$,not 1000. As K404 all those crazy samples should be in another league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreYang Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 wow, BZ. I saw someone has a 6.5G+ 3D retail 980X on Computex Live show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hipro5 Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 I will be the "bad" guy once again!.... Â SF3D how do you feel while you loose places from top 20 from Hiwa while he's benching at Computex with NickShih's rig?.....Do you feel happy?..... Â Everyone's benching with another's rig and uploading resaults lately I see.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF3D Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 There is nothing I can do about it. Life is not fair like I said earlier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hipro5 Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 There is nothing I can do about it. Life is not fair like I said earlier  Despite this, aren't you a bit mad/pissed off about this?.... I would be... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF3D Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 Well..possible hardware sharing and ES vs. Retail discussion are two different topics. No need to be mad. They do what they think is best for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 It's nice to speculate and dream about moving A0 (or 'freaky samples') to another category, but the practical side of things isn't so easy. Â - Who goes into what category? - Can we force someone to go to one category? - Can you live with not being placed in the 'pro' category? - What to do with the normal overclockers who bought one A0? - What happens to the point distribution: different category, but how to give points to team? - Can results from the pro category affect points from the normal category? - etc ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hipro5 Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 it's Nice To Speculate And Dream About Moving A0 (or 'freaky Samples') To Another Category, But The Practical Side Of Things Isn't So Easy. - Who Goes Into What Category? - Can We Force Someone To Go To One Category? - Can You Live With Not Being Placed In The 'pro' Category? - What To Do With The Normal Overclockers Who Bought One A0? - What Happens To The Point Distribution: Different Category, But How To Give Points To Team? - Can Results From The Pro Category Affect Points From The Normal Category? - Etc ...  F(l)uck!!..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenchZowner Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 I will be the "bad" guy once again!....  SF3D how do you feel while you loose places from top 20 from Hiwa while he's benching at Computex with NickShih's rig?.....Do you feel happy?.....  Everyone's benching with another's rig and uploading resaults lately I see....  If it's ok for you guys, then let's all go to Aristidis's place and bench with his system ( mainly his freaky i7 980X )  It's nice to speculate and dream about moving A0 (or 'freaky samples') to another category, but the practical side of things isn't so easy. - Who goes into what category? - Can we force someone to go to one category? - Can you live with not being placed in the 'pro' category? - What to do with the normal overclockers who bought one A0? - What happens to the point distribution: different category, but how to give points to team? - Can results from the pro category affect points from the normal category? - etc ...  Is it necessary to have a league where the crazy E.S. should be allowed ? I think not having E.S. hardware in the rankings is an easier solution than creating another league with the E.S. hardware permitted. If you have to have the E.S. up, just create another category and give that league it's own ranking ( same point system, etc, just another db ). People with E.S. CPU's go to that league whether they like it or not. Points not being added to the member's team, or "split" the teams to pro/amateur leagues. Results from the pro category affect the pro category only, like I said before different leagues, separate database. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 I have plenty of ES CPUs, but I've never been sponsored with ANYTHING. And I'm not alone. Splitting based on owning an ES or not is a bad idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenchZowner Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 All I know is that the E.S. ( and especially those that can't be matched, i5 670, i7 980X, QX9650 ) shouldn't be allowed in the rankings. What shall be done, splitting HWbot into 2 leagues, or just disallowing the E.S. is none of my business and obviously not my choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K404 Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 I have plenty of ES CPUs, but I've never been sponsored with ANYTHING. And I'm not alone. Splitting based on owning an ES or not is a bad idea.  It would help limit the appeal of ES slightly. Buying warranty-less £800 chips in order to compete is a dangerous thing to "encourage" I'm sure Intel & AMD won't mind if theres less incentive to have them as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 It would help limit the appeal of ES slightly. Buying warranty-less £800 chips in order to compete is a dangerous thing to "encourage" I'm sure Intel & AMD won't mind if theres less incentive to have them as well  I buy them because they're cool to have. Especially AMD ones, as they're rare. Plus, some unreleased models are only available as ES. Scored a QX9750 on ebay the other day, for example - which will only compete against itself, in it's own HW category. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreYang Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 I will be the "bad" guy once again!.... Â SF3D how do you feel while you loose places from top 20 from Hiwa while he's benching at Computex with NickShih's rig?.....Do you feel happy?..... Â Everyone's benching with another's rig and uploading resaults lately I see.... Â Â Â Hiwa follows the hwbot rule for sure. 3D can share cpu, but VGA card. Â He bought some cards here and "someone" helps him mod everything he wants. I know you hipro know who is someone. He is at gskill booth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hipro5 Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Hiwa follows the hwbot rule for sure. 3D can share cpu, but VGA card. He bought some cards here and "someone" helps him mod everything he wants. I know you hipro know who is someone. He is at gskill booth.  In Hiwa's place, he's "legal" as for hwbot rules because he's NOT a PURE member (as of yet)...... So he's doing OK as for me...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Is it necessary to have a league where the crazy E.S. should be allowed ?I think not having E.S. hardware in the rankings is an easier solution than creating another league with the E.S. hardware permitted. If you have to have the E.S. up, just create another category and give that league it's own ranking ( same point system, etc, just another db ). People with E.S. CPU's go to that league whether they like it or not. Points not being added to the member's team, or "split" the teams to pro/amateur leagues. Results from the pro category affect the pro category only, like I said before different leagues, separate database. Â * Please insert a million coins in HWBOT slot machine * Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SF3D Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Hiwa follows the hwbot rule for sure. 3D can share cpu, but VGA card. He bought some cards here and "someone" helps him mod everything he wants. I know you hipro know who is someone. He is at gskill booth.  http://www.storyofmylife.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal-EL Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 There are alot of frustrated people out there. ES vs Retail, Pro's vs Joe's, Afraid to compete NDA cb mod agreements, sharing is caring sessions, Enforce/don't Enforce rules, its quite the pisser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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