I.M.O.G. Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 You played with subtimings? That is what people have said about MA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massman Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 It's related to tREF, iirc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 (edited) I think orb Link has to be for each top 20 global. Changing Audio Codec they cant do it! Most people using changed Codec and cant submit because corrupted files.... Its easy to trick, changing Codecs with Orb...but isnt allowed. Also you can trick the hdd tests to get impressive scores without needing good storage. Â Make clear rules, now! Edited September 27, 2012 by Moose83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GENiEBEN Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Safe to say 05 needs no rules anymore..or points for that matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Agree, everything allowed or remove it completly... But Audio only can be done with Codec replacement! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crew pro Posted September 27, 2012 Crew Share Posted September 27, 2012 yeah replacing anything not allowed for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Scott Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 Safe to say 05 needs no rules anymore..or points for that matter. Totally agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 I think orb Link has to be for each top 20 global.Changing Audio Codec they cant do it! Most people using changed Codec and cant submit because corrupted files.... Its easy to trick, changing Codecs with Orb...but isnt allowed. Also you can trick the hdd tests to get impressive scores without needing good storage.  Make clear rules, now!  Then show us how they're done so we can actually figure out if something is not right:p  The question here is if we just go by trust and say OK, or if we investigate properly. IMO any tweak that gives an insane boost should be disallowed until it's 100% sure that it's indeed legal, even if it means that some people do hard work only for the benefit of everybody. benefit of the doubt doesn't exist when you see such things as text edit and transparent windows. Hell, make that web page rendering as well. Powertoy saved the wmv-related subtest, and the explanation related to raidexpert saved that one as well.  Personally I'd prefer that we blocked all subs with these unverified tweaks. A gain of a few percent can be easily explained by normal efficiency tuning, when a score goes up by more than 10% it raises an eyebrow or two. I mean, increase nature FPS the way web page rendering or text edit scores have gone up and you'll see what I mean:p  The only way to investigate properly is to be able to dig into it ourselves. Sadly, those who spent their clever minds to figure everything out, it makes their work give them less of an edge than they hoped for, but it's the only option we have left if we want to keep at least global points for this benchmark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 Christian Ney know them and how they work... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Ney Posted September 28, 2012 Author Share Posted September 28, 2012 No tall and maybe some people use a different way to achieve almost same result Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 Most are working to replace files in pcm05... but actually rules say not allowed right? Also Codec change not allowed right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Ney Posted September 28, 2012 Author Share Posted September 28, 2012 Yep as actual rule stats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 That's what the rules state, and any moderator must be able to give a judgement. At the moment you have two groups of people: those who know the tweak(s) and use them (and are therefore biased because they gain something from having them allowed), and those who don't know and obviously don't use them (and are therefore biased because they lose points/rankings vs those who know the tweaks). if we decide to go by the people who use the tweaks while keeping them secret, we don't know if it's a biased opinion or not. In fact, we don't know in either case - which means we should look for solid proof to be able to make the correct decision. Â We could always vote on this, too. Allow or disallow tweak x, and a separate poll for y etc. If the majority of the forum members want to keep these things in the system in an unferified state, then maybe we could do just that. Public opinion is a valid point. Personally I'd vote a hard "no" in all cases until I've got a chance to investigate this myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GENiEBEN Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 We could always vote on this, too. Allow or disallow tweak x, and a separate poll for y etc. If the majority of the forum members want to keep these things in the system in an unferified state, then maybe we could do just that. Public opinion is a valid point. Personally I'd vote a hard "no" in all cases until I've got a chance to investigate this myself. Â Â Now you see the relevance of the thread I was searching for? One more thing I;d like to add, the TE and WBR tweaks can be % tweaked, so if you can do 30pages @4GHz I can do 31 using the tweak, only dumbed down. Moderate that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 (edited) Yes te and webpage i can do every Limit i want.... Â There are only 2 options now, keep PC Mark and allow everything.... or remove it completly.... can i score with 20k vs now too....or should we Set limits for the subtests? Â Pcm05 should be renamed to script it or scriptmark;) Â It cant be moderated any more... Edited September 28, 2012 by Moose83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 (edited) http://www.3dmark.com/pcm05/3171703 Â This is Audio Comp Tweak, 4 times higher than standart... Validated ORB Futuremark link. But, can you say, what i did??? Did i replace the Codec in working Folder or other stuff??? Test it by your own, change Codec in PCM working folder and try to go to Futuremark with it...it wouldnt work, you get error 10 by coruppted files;) All guys, using high Audio Comp cant go to ORB, because they changed Codec. Gluvecco can do also it with ORB Link, but who would you moderate it? Edited September 28, 2012 by Moose83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhenzjhen Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 I'm starting to love pcm05 now more than molesting 775's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanutzuAC Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 It can be moderated. When something looks fishy... first are asked questions, if answer do not satisfy...BAN. Simple like this. Keep it simple, are enough tweeks alowed to boost the score. Â A little respect for those who had made efforts to achiev good results, spending money for good scores in HDD tests or for very good cooling for keeping the system at high frequency. I don't like the idea of throwing all that work to the garbage just because some people can't stand the idea to stay in line and tend to pass in front by any means. Â For those who consider themselves good tweekers, it's the posibility to make submissions without competing, explaining the procedure, and if it is considered legal, they can simply to uncheck an option. Â Is It something wrong with the way in which I see things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 We can't ban if something was done in good faith. This is not North Korea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Yeah cant ban, but can make updated rules. Also storage is an good point, why is an bugged driver/Tool allowed? AMD RAID expert is bugged, Software RAID clean the floor with an 4000 Dollar Hardware RAID... No hdd test recognice the magic 10g RAID only pcm05 shows an score what have nothing to do with Performance, only shows an bug! Sounds only that someone like to see AMD in top places for me... Hdtune for example wont work with it only error... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.nfraR.ed Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 The question is why HDTune doesn't work with it, but PCMark05 works and how PCMark is indicative for system performance If a 3DMark run bugs and I see a black screen through the whole subtest, then when my subtest score is a lot higher than comparable systems, my score is invalid (for obvious reasons). When someone discovers another loophole/exploit in PCMark, then it's a tweak. Â But yeah..I'm a hater, you know . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose83 Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Because hdtune cant mess an bug;) thinking now same as gluvo, ramdisk should no problem too, to give Intel a Chance against the magic AMD bug, lol:q Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GENiEBEN Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Because hdtune cant mess an bug;) thinking now same as gluvo, ramdisk should no problem too, to give Intel a Chance against the magic AMD bug, lol:q  Dont recall RAMDISK boosting VS to 9000 ever, but overall score should be close. I get 400K points in the HDD Suite using 1600C9 2GB ramdisk, can you test with Raid Expert? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Scott Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 The question is why HDTune doesn't work with it, but PCMark05 works and how PCMark is indicative for system performance If a 3DMark run bugs and I see a black screen through the whole subtest, then when my subtest score is a lot higher than comparable systems, my score is invalid (for obvious reasons). When someone discovers another loophole/exploit in PCMark, then it's a tweak. Â But yeah..I'm a hater, you know . It's ok, you can hang with me and the other haters anytime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knopflerbruce Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 HDTune bugs. That's for sure. The disk is fine, still HDTune won't run. That's proof of nothing else than a bug in that app Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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