The line between ambient water and chilled/cold

[Hilderman]

No rush, we will be waiting for you.

[KaRtA]

Good move Hilderman. Respect man, much respect.

 

I had aspirations to move with my 7700k to go on DICE as it was such a damn good sample. It was my motivation, but now with it's death, the move is on hold (loss of funds now the issue).

 

I see no real point hanging in enthusiast much longer when the mentality of the Top 10 is they want to be the best (at being average). My aim was to make Top 10, but not sure I want that stigma against my name.

 

Hell, one of them was supposed to move with the German RoG competition last year and still there, it shows they just cant progress.

[Hilderman]

My condolences on the 7700k and hope you are able to purchase another one just as good. I can relate as many of us are on a tight budget with regards to our love of benching but we push the bunny extraction out of them anyway. I'm looking forward to *attempting* to delid mine, as I think its a decent sample - (50/45 1.85 - 52/45 1.29 cb 15 ??) and learn how to use dry ice. Should be fun. I'll see you in Apprentice when you get there.

[knopflerbruce]

Just a thought: why not just set the bar a certain temperature for whatever cooling medium you use? Not that I have a good suggestion on what that temp should be. EKoolant freezes at -15C, so it's good for some subzero benching during winter. I was going to suggest 0C, but given the safe temps for these premixed fluids that might not be ideal.

[speed.fastest]

Thats why change not chilled water cooler, but Cold Water and Warm Water. Cold Water can go to Apprentice

[suzuki]

My opinion,0 degrees and above = enthusiast.

Under 0 -> apprentice.

 

If outside is -15-30 and you go bench-> you are a panda,gtfo to apprentice.

 

 

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[ZFeSS]

I don't understand this "apprentice" thing. If you force you cooling methods to go below ambient - that's extreme cooling. In other case - Enthusiast. Apprentice - what is this? DI is about -78 degrees, also you need a pot, skill, knowledge, insulation, and buy it every time. If you take your PC outside it's not extreme in any way, it cost nothing and accessible for every novice. I don't care about leagues but I don't understand why simplest and cheapest method of better cooling is not suitable for enthusiast league.

[newlife]

I don't understand this "apprentice" thing. If you force you cooling methods to go below ambient - that's extreme cooling. In other case - Enthusiast. Apprentice - what is this? DI is about -78 degrees, also you need a pot, skill, knowledge, insulation, and buy it every time. If you take your PC outside it's not extreme in any way, it cost nothing and accessible for every novice. I don't care about leagues but I don't understand why simplest and cheapest method of better cooling is not suitable for enthusiast league.

 

Apprentice is a beginners extreme league and dice is a steeping stone to ln2

[ZFeSS]

Apprentice is a beginners extreme league and dice is a steeping stone to ln2

Why taking PC outside of your room is the same level of "extreme" as DI? Please add the rule "Cooling SS rad with cold air makes it same as LN2".

[suzuki]

Sometimes it is extreme because in some countryes your ambient will never go below 0 and on others you have winter.

Between 0 and -20 degrees your cpu can go up with another 200 mhz so how is that fair for others ?

Enthusiast should be about equal conditions,if you stay in the house and you have only vga and power cable drawn outside in your pc at -20 and you stay inside at plus 26 with a wireless keyboard and mouse in your hand for me it doesn't seem fair.

 

 

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[Mr.Scott]

I would say that people that live and bench in Siberia need to be cut some slack.

[ZFeSS]

Sometimes it is extreme because in some countryes your ambient will never go below 0 and on others you have winter.

Between 0 and -20 degrees your cpu can go up with another 200 mhz so how is that fair for others ?

Sometimes it is extreme because in some countryes in summer your ambient rise to +40 and on others you have +20.

Between 20 and 40 degrees your cpu can go up with another 200 mhz so how is that fair for others?

Today's conditions are different than last week, temps drop by 10 degrees. Is it fair? I am not in equal condition to myself.

"Enthusiast should be about equal conditions" is impossible for obvious reason. Such thing never exists and no one can control this equality.

if you stay in the house and you have only vga and power cable drawn outside in your pc at -20 and you stay inside at plus 26 with a wireless keyboard and mouse in your hand for me it doesn't seem fair.

So, if you stay outside it becomes more fair then? We talk about PC cooling or about freezing people?

[speed.fastest]

I never benching at ambient <20°C. My city at all weather never went 18°C, even 22-24°C is very rare. On my 7700K im at 30°C ambient did 5.3-5.4ghz 05 and at 20°C ambient with strong Air Conditioner, can R15 at 5.3/5.4GHz, XTU 5.25ghz and 05 5.5ghz. I cant imagine if i go below 10 or 0 ambient. Thats why make 2 Water Categories :

>0°C Enthusiast (Warm Water)

<0°C Apprentice (Cold Water)

[PKBO]

You need better chip speed. I found best chip few days ago, whitch can do 5,51 ghz XTU 1,6-1,65V, 21c ambient. Doenst have balls push there more even with lower temp, i dont think it will help me here, will se, now its too hot outside, i can push down ambient to 14-15C with AC working all the day, but for lower temp it has to be cold outside like month before.

 

There is my 1933 run

Doesnt submited it yet, need tweak ram first, it seems harder on apex than on older impact eh..

Edited April 12, 2017 by PKBO

[Fasttrack]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

In my country, we have a saying :

 

" Don't speak for a rope in the hanged man's house ".

 

Don't you think so @Elkim ?

[Elkim]

I think I'll go eat a snickers

 

 

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[Fasttrack]

I think I'll go eat a snickers

 

 

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Haha.

I could use one myself. Lol...

[Elkim]

Seems like a container in stock should be mandatory as part of OC'ers equipment these days

 

 

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[speed.fastest]

You need better chip speed. I found best chip few days ago, whitch can do 5,51 ghz XTU 1,6-1,65V, 21c ambient. Doenst have balls push there more even with lower temp, i dont think it will help me here, will se, now its too hot outside, i can push down ambient to 14-15C with AC working all the day, but for lower temp it has to be cold outside like month before.

 

There is my 1933 run

Doesnt submited it yet, need tweak ram first, it seems harder on apex than on older impact eh..

 

Talking about chip i've seen Hazzan chip that did 5.5GHz R15 under EK L360 Kit 30C Ambient, and can only do 5.6GHz under LN2. He use it for 5.2GHz daily at 1.2v. But this is not the case i talk. I mean Cooling category between Water (Warm) and (Cold) is can be separated too because it can affecting a lot!

[knopflerbruce]

What sort of fluid would you use for "water" cooling in a siberian winter? Not anything common, I would assume. And aren't heat pipe based coolers bad when the internal fluid is too cold to evaporate?

[suzuki]

Depends on the air cooler,ussually most of them at -8 are dead meat. Megahalems can go to -12.

Coolant you find for car radiators -19 degrees rated,add some alcohol in the mix and the rating goes lower.

Or you can just prepare your own with 99.9% alcohol from comerce.

Do you really think this would be a problem ?

 

 

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[Antinomy]

I use my tap, that's all. There are guys who run antifreeze with a rad outside with -30 temps. But in my place it rarely gets below -15c so I don't see a point so such complex solutions. -30 outside doesn't mean -30 antifreeze in the system. The heatpipes are a problem. Only some of them work normally at -10 and I suppose none below -20. 7700Cu to the rescue.

Enthusiast should be about equal conditions,if you stay in the house and you have only vga and power cable drawn outside in your pc at -20 and you stay inside at plus 26 with a wireless keyboard and mouse in your hand for me it doesn't seem fair.

So now extreme cooling is about freezing your arse, not chips?

I would say that people that live and bench in Siberia need to be cut some slack.

I kinda live on the same latitude as you. And way away from Siberia.

[ZFeSS]

Coolant you find for car radiators -19 degrees rated,add some alcohol in the mix and the rating goes lower.

It's too complex. Just buy -40 rated one, $10 for 5L, it's available in every store with car goods. Rated for something like -20 is impossible to find here.

[GtiJason]

Just stumbled on this thread last night.

Read all 14 pages and was reminded of the sour taste this whole ambient debate brought out in me last fall during the MSI Ambient contest.

I spent way to much time at my keyboard trying to get the mods to clear away the grey area to no avail, and in the process forgot the pure enjoyment that benching had brought me in the past. The prizes were big $, based on my budget, but the grey area involved in ambient destroyed the enjoyment and brought out a side of me I didn't like. The result of that debacle was a ruined cpu and a very negative attitude, although I did win an MSI hat, keychain, notebook and an open bench table - (open bench table is great, thank you MSI).

I haven't bothered to compete since, other than the Geekbench memory challenge, which was a lot of fun, and the Country Cup in Dec. Maybe I'm just a whiney, sore loser, and clearly need to eat a few more Snickers.

Whatever the case, that was my experience.

After reading this thread, I'd like to remove myself from the Enthusiast class and challenge any of my "class-mates" to move to Apprentice as well. Perhaps there should be a time limit of some sort to stay in Enthusiast.

Anyways, Websmile, or Christian, what is the process to change to Apprentice, and can anyone recommend a budget friendly pot for purchase? It's time for me to learn about cold.

Please excuse my lengthy post.

 

Great attitude ! If you want to try my EK cpu pot it's yours for as long as you need it !

I know it's not one of the best pots but I used it for most of my cold 4770k results so it "works". I'm talking about my EK SF3D Inflection point pot with Intel 115x mounting base.

Send me pm if interested, no strings attatched

[Hilderman]

That would be awesome and much appreciated. Pm incoming